Nomad Willy
Guru
REALMOUNTIE,
Thanks for the video.
Really liked watching the wake of this wonderful hull.
Thanks for the video.
Really liked watching the wake of this wonderful hull.
If you combine this quote of mine, along with my previous posting #109....
Take into consideration these two postings, and then read a first hand account of a fellow (JAM) who just recently attended one of Kelsall's workshops
Since I only got a couple of request to see the files before I posted them I was going to just add those email addresses to the share list. But since I posted the files I have gotten more than 50 more requests so I changed the sharing type on the folder to be available to anyone with this link. Thus it now functions similar to DropBox. These image files are high resolution so you can zoom in on photos to see details. The videos are even bigger of course.
https://drive.google.com/folderview?id=0B8F19GqZmyhoUXBma1NUblo2Umc&usp=sharing
Since I have not had time to edit them or label them, viewing by time stamp (file name) my be the best way to put things in order. If you hover over the icon in the upper right that is composed of 6 horizontal lines you will see that it is named LIST VIEW, that will let you see the full file names better. You can decode the file names as follows:
IMG_20140911_122657_726 = Media recorded Sept 11, 2014, 12:26 PM and 57.726 seconds.
There is a download button too. Feel free to do anything you want with them. Questions welcome, I know before the seminar I would have no idea what is going on!
jam
I thought all of the P-40's had the ladder to the roof to the right of the sliding doors.
drf6 said:Pilgrim #9, #10 and #18 (possible others) had the second ladder to the boat deck behind the starboard side pilot house door.
I was in Indian Town , Fl. and saw a Pilgram out of the water. Very nice hull. I am thinking about a vessel like her for just ICW and protected water cursing. ..... Do any have center line queens forward.
Another vessel that reminds me of the Pilgrim 40 design,...thanks for posting Al.Looking for a tie to Sam Matsumoto boat builder in the late 40s in B.C. Canada. Found this in the search, looks as an active boat according to the current owner of 2013 note.
Lillian Belle | Alan Haig-Brown
Al
Just to clear up this ladder subject, what I was commenting on Scotte was a second ladder up front:
All Pilgrim 40 are classics and do have a certain « Je ne sais quoi » (I don't know what)
I owned one and lived aboard for a while and I know What. The P40 is a lovely boat and very efficient. The What is a real roll and I am not talking about something you buy at the bakery. Anyone who is serious about redesigning the P40 should make sure they address that issue or confine the boat to quite no wake water.
All Pilgrim 40 are classics and do have a certain « Je ne sais quoi » (I don't know what)
I owned one and lived aboard for a while and I know What. The P40 is a lovely boat and very efficient. The What is a real roll and I am not talking about something you buy at the bakery. Anyone who is serious about redesigning the P40 should make sure they address that issue or confine the boat to quite no wake water.
here is a P40 here at the Marina he spends a few months on the hook and then comes in for a week or so to the dock to do his work
he told me recently that he now stays on the inside when cruising
it is a beautiful boat and this guy sure takes care of it
All Pilgrim 40 are classics and do have a certain « Je ne sais quoi » (I don't know what)
Our 1986 Pilgrim 40 will be soon considered in Florida state as being eligible for registration as an “antique vessel”, being a 30 year old boat.
I keep a log of maintenance on our boat as we all know that restorations of old boats that were not well maintained over the years are very costly.
I am in the opinion that person who choose to buy a Pilgrim 40 at low cost may find out the hard way as it is just as expensive and may be more expensive refit even if you make a good deal on a fixer upper.
Most surveyors will say that you cannot refit on the cheap. Money being the name of the game. Remember Quality Vs Quantity, this why quality boats like Hatteras, Tiara, Bertram and Viking cost so much is because of the quality materials that go into their construction.
If you haven't got it, I think you must give close consideration to Refit costs VS Resale value.
It might be a mistake for the old boat buyer making an underestimate of putting things back in order in shape.
There is a rule of thumb to allow 50% of a boat cost (in above average condition) for a 100% in poor condition.
This depends on the relationship between replacement value cost (500,000$) for a Pilgrim 40 and the average market asking price depending on equipment options (from 99,000$, 138,000$ and more as listed on the spread sheet of Dates and Listed Prices for Pilgrims dating back as far as 2009).
I am in agreement with my good friend Mike. You do not recover your costs with a new Pilgrim 40.
You do not recover your costs with a new boat, at the same time, you will not recover your costs with a refurbished used boat either.
Pilgrim 40 have enjoyed an excellent reputation, they are not an investment, they are a luxury item for your own pleasure.
While I expect to get more than what I paid, it may not be all that much more.
The questions remains here:
Q1: How much a buyer or owner is willing to spend, now, towards making a Pilgrim 40 looking and function like new?
Q2: How much any available Pilgrim 40 will be worthed in 5, 10, 15 years?
My first sentence after the quote really is specific That this it's not a redesign of the P40. You may not see the similarities in design language. Certainly different in function. My design isn't meant to be a copy or reproduction of any existing vessel. If I could add a hull appendage to an existing production boat to achieve my ideal boat wouldn't I be lucky!
Some people are quite literally minded. But design is subjective. For example to me Nordic and American tugs look like Roto molded kayaks and have the authentic street cred of a PT Cruiser.
Man-Hrs for Steel Hull Construction (part 1) ....excerpt
.....Lets choose the hull design to be considered for this estimating exercise. The more I study the options, the more convinced I've become that the hull forms offered by the Florida Bay Coasters and the great Harbor Trawlers are a very favorable choice for this displacement speed Pilgrim. The hulls from both of these designs are very similar designs and have a documented favorable track record. Their hard chines, and considerable flat panel areas lend themselves to relatively easy fabrication in metal.
Look at a few of these hull cross-sections and photos.
First a few of the original Pilgrim design.
View attachment 24479
View attachment 24480
View attachment 24481
Then an overlaid depiction of that Pilgrim hull type, compared to the hard chine section of a Great Harbor hull.
View attachment 24482
Here are a few hull sections of the Fla Bay Coaster hard chine type
View attachment 24483
View attachment 24484
…..and some photos of these Fla Bay coaster hull types,
View attachment 24485
View attachment 24486
View attachment 24487
View attachment 24488
This is NOT a really difficult hull shape to build.....lots of 'flat' or single curvature panels, and no mult-chine.
I would likely go one step further and do a more complete review of a variation on the FBC hull design that Jay Benford did, his design #295, a “West Coaster” for a gentleman who lived in California. That client wanted similar livability, plus more ability to deal with open ocean cruising. To achieve this Jay modified the hull form, particularly in the bow, giving it a finer entry and more flare.