Planning a long hop

[mvweebles]

Hey Kevin. As you meander your way to La Paz, you will encounter this conundrum a few times, not always during times when daylight is abundant. I have no idea of the practical aspects, but if I were in your shoes, I'd noodle through some sort of drogue for drift abatement for either comfortable sleep or buy time during a mechanical failure. There was a very recent thread on TF. The Burke Seabrake is affordable, compact, and well rated by Practical Sailor. Appears to be relatively easily retrieved which is key. Maybe light-up the decks to emulate a fisherman.

Kevin, I'm going to say the following less to you than to others who might be persuaded by your solo feat. It is not possible to stand a proper watch as a single hander past about 20-hours or so (condition dependent). Setting alarms and such - even the sea anchor suggestion above - cedes a fair amount of collision avoidance responsibility to fellow mariners. In my book, unless the result of unforseen circumstances, not only is if in defiance of the Rules, it's arrogant and rude.

That said, good luck. I really appreciate your candor as you prepare for your trip.

Peter

 

[Retriever]

FWIW, we saw very few logs or other floating debris on our two Gulf of Alaska crossing last summer.

Why not go to Icy Bay first? If I had to do the trip alone I'd run 15 knots for the 175nm to Icy Bay, anchor, sleep. Then it's only 60nm to Yakutat. Yakutat to Lituya Bay is only about 100nm, then it's another ~60nm to Cape Spencer, so you could do all that at trawler speed.

Or, find some crew and knock out the whole Gulf of Alaska in one good weather window. That's what we did last summer and it was remarkably easy and I arrived well-rested!

 

[Fletcher500]

There is a guy in his late 70’s who periodically stops in SD on his way down from AK to Mex where he winters over. He has done 20 solo trips from AK to SD in a sailboat and only recently had to start bringing someone with him due to his age. Long trips like this are not for the faint of heart, especially solo.

I have never met you, or even spoken with you, but I have read many of your posts the past 6 years. You appear to be very sharp technically, have installed much of your own boat gear as well as maintain it, and you have done extensive solo cruising in the past preparing for this trip.

I retired almost 2 years ago and having the extra time to explore and not worry about weather windows has been great. You will love retirement.

Looking forward to following along with you virtually on your adventure

 

[DDW]

Single handed sailors do this all the time (and for weeks at a time), napping with alarms set. There is some risk but the statistics are the risk is pretty small. Many decades ago, sailors would park the boat (by heaving to or with a sea anchor) to sleep. More recently they just carry on. If I were needing to do that trip solo, I'd have a parachute sea anchor which could be used to park if the weather deteriorated or sleep caught up (and often it is the combination that causes trouble).

You may want to enquire about your insurance status for such a trip (or maybe you don't want to know....). Often there will be an exclusion for offshore unless X number of crew present.

 

[Hippocampus]

1. You cannot train your body to do it. Please read the science. Shift working carries a large number of risks. Surprisingly even up to a doubling of the risk of developing cancer.( work rules for shift work has been changed in many regions by regulation as an attempt to lower the risks). It places a hard burden your body even if not elderly and even if you’re quite fit.
2. Being up that long is just plain dangerous. I used to do single handed races and passages. After becoming apprised about how much my functional abilities declined even with fairly modest sleep deprivation I stopped doing it.
3. You can’t bank sleep. Your performance reflects your state of sleep deprivation at that time.
4. Check your insurance. You may not be covered if single handing. You are thinking about a relatively short trip. I don’t know about that as it relates to insurance coverage . I do know my current and the past insurance vendors I’ve had have stipulated a minimum number of crew for passages. Some have required after my vetting they approve the crew list. From what I’ve experienced they generally want at least 3 individuals who are sufficiently skilled as to be able to operate the boat independently by themself.

Conclusion- get or hire crew. I’ve used crew services in the past. Have yet to need to hire crew. Rarely have needed to pay for anything more than direct boat costs (food/drink/fees while physically on the boat ). Have gotten excellent crew with few exceptions. Between crew services and word of mouth (personally prefer word of mouth) think you could avoid the stress and risks involved with single handing. Also you meet great people. Some become long term friends.
DDW what you say is true with the caveat “in the past “. I did it “in the past”. As stated above and confirmed by personal experience nearly impossible to get insured at present for such activities. You may find yourself in effect self insured. My attitude was for a Bermuda one two or like activity if the boat sank I’d likely be dead so wouldn’t care. If I survived I’d be so thankful the total loss would be an “oh well….”
At least in my circle of friends and acquaintances no one single hands anymore except for day trips. It’s a thing of the past for many reasons. Increased crap in the water, insurance, weather instability, need for collision avoidance and given the current size of container ships, cruise ships, and VLCCs even getting anywhere close to them. Yes outside shipping channels in very limited controlled settings folks still do it. But those have become very rare. Although never commonplace when I started sailing it wasn’t that unusual. Now it’s a extremely rare activity.

Sorry to be harsh. In your scenario having even one crew makes this a pleasant trip. Solo, it’s stressful and risky.

 

[ksanders]

Seems to be a real mix of opinions, and I appreciate all the insight.

Regarding my insurance... I know my policy to the letter and there are no exclusions for single handling. I have a policy with coastal limitations and none of this journey is offshore.

I think I am going to approach this like this.

On May 5 there is less than 3 hours of time beyond nautical twilight.

Hold after hop 1 until i have a perfect three day weather window. That time of year the weather is generally benign, but I can hold literally indefinitely very comfortably.

Refuel after hop 1 to give me choices as to how to proceed.

Get at least one full nights sleep after hop 1.

Starting hop 2 I'm going to proceed at displacement speed to the area of Kayak island. I will leave very early in the morning.

At Kayak island evaluate the sea conditions and the anchorage in the area Doug suggested. If this looks reasonable set the hook and spend the night.

If this area does not look reasonable then I will keep going but will probably get up on plane at that point.

That will result in a 18 hour day, all during daylight. I have done that alone before, no big deal.

Waiting to go up on plane until past Kayak island will reduce the chances of hitting a log dramatically. As Doug pointed out the logs come from Prince William Sound, and the Copper River. Once past those areas the risk of a log encounter go down dramatically.

The good thing is that I have made this exact same journey twice before abet in the opposite direction. The differences are that those were trips with a schedule, and i had two people on board.

 

[rslifkin]

Seems to be a real mix of opinions, and I appreciate all the insight.

Regarding my insurance... I know my policy to the letter and there are no exclusions for single handling. I have a policy with coastal limitations and none of this journey is offshore.

I think I am going to approach this like this.

On May 5 there is less than 3 hours of time beyond nautical twilight.

Hold after hop 1 until i have a perfect three day weather window. That time of year the weather is generally benign, but I can hold literally indefinitely very comfortably.

Refuel after hop 1 to give me choices as to how to proceed.

Get at least one full nights sleep after hop 1.

Starting hop 2 I'm going to proceed at displacement speed to the area of Kayak island. I will leave very early in the morning.

At Kayak island evaluate the sea conditions and the anchorage in the area Doug suggested. If this looks reasonable set the hook and spend the night.

If this area does not look reasonable then I will keep going but will probably get up on plane at that point.

That will result in a 18 hour day, all during daylight. I have done that alone before, no big deal.

Waiting to go up on plane until past Kayak island will reduce the chances of hitting a log dramatically. As Doug pointed out the logs come from Prince William Sound, and the Copper River. Once past those areas the risk of a log encounter go down dramatically.

That sounds like a good plan to me. Looking at the charts, it looks like there should be a few spots around Kayak island to anchor with reasonable protection depending on wind direction, etc.

 

[Larry M]

Crew vs no crew? Personally I’m not a fan of crew unless I’ve boated with them very extensively. When moving our boat I’ve found I get less sleep when I have crew. Granted there there were two of us when we did our off shore passages but I trusted Lena. She knew when to get me up and I slept well. The boat was our only home and I knew every squeak, creak and noise. The two times we had crew I found I couldn’t sleep well or slept with one eye open. When ever there was a wind or sea shift I was up. When we had company and doing passages they’d stand watch with one of us but not alone.

A 24-27 hour passage shouldn’t be a big deal to an experienced boater (Kevin) with a well equipped boat. The same things that can go wrong on a 3 hour cruise, so? Just ask Gilligan.

 

[Fletcher500]

I am glad he didn’t say he was going to take the same trip in an automobile on the freeway, where the chances of being seriously injured or killed are probably 10X greater than a solo boat trip covering the same distance.

 

[AKDoug]

There are those who do, and those who will always find an excuse not to... Not condemning either camp, but as Kevin pointed out to me "a day on the water is a day on the water." Taken one at a time they are all manageable!

 

[ksanders]

There are those who do, and those who will always find an excuse not to... Not condemning either camp, but as Kevin pointed out to me "a day on the water is a day on the water." Taken one at a time they are all manageable!

It's funny I was discussing this voyage last night over dinner.

The statement was made that 4,000 miles to La Paz is a Long way!

My response was that I'm not going 4,000 miles.

I am going on a bunch of easy peasy day trips.

 

[Hippocampus]

Have done a fair amount of passages and have a fair number of friends more experienced then me.
The fatigue is irrelevant until you hit weather or something breaks or you get sick or hurt or a myriad number of things. Any long term open water passage maker will have a stock of stories of those occurrences.
The old saying about ocean passages is true. You don’t have it unless you brought it with you. That includes your skill set, healthy sound body and mind as well as tools and spares. As skipper I pay attention to my crews health, level of hydration, food intake and sleep. Any story you hear or read about a mid ocean catastrophe is a chain reaction of multiple small issues cascading into bigger ones. A major component is fatigue from sleep deprivation. The worst weather, hull piercing, mechanical failure would have often been ameliorable to more successful intervention if the crew wasn’t fatigued.
Part of your job as skipper is to be nervous. Not anxious but doing the what ifs and being aware. I’ve yet to do a passage when I didn’t learn something from my crew. I’ve yet to do a passage where I wasn’t consciously or subconsciously aware of the sounds and working of the boat. Same when serving as crew.
Vetting crew is a skill. But not that hard to learn. Having crew is one of the great parts of boating. You learn stuff. I intentionally pick people who have diverse backgrounds. From different places. Different educational and career backgrounds. Different ages. Different outlooks on life. You end up with the most amazing conversations. There’s a lot of downtime on a boat on passage. I have looked forward to passages in part because of those crew interactions.
You’ll never get rid of your awareness of your boat if you’re a good skipper. Wife’s at the wheel. We’re a mom and pop 95% of the time. I’m deeply asleep as the prior day was tiring due to line squalls. Before she goes to wake I’m up and headed to the aft compartment. The pin in the AP linkage to the rudder post fell out. Although fuzzy having just woke that sound and the fraction of second for her to take the wheel as the AP was no longer attached was enough. Knew what it was and what to do. Was able to grab the bolt and it’s nut before they wandered off. Nut was a nylock. Bolt secured with a cotter pin. Never happened before. Still you’re aware. That doesn’t change regardless of who else is aboard. What does change is the event was a non issue because there was someone else at the helm.

 

[AKDoug]

Been there, done that. The key in the rudder post was undersized and worked out while my companion was on watch. Fortunately I carry an emergency tiller and was simply able to drop it on and hand steer the keyway back into alignment and drop it back in. One of my first end of trip reminders was to get the right sized key and a spare!

Sometimes it is really puzzling what happens when a boat gets put together! With only 47 hours on the boat when I bought it, I am sure when it was manufactured it was done that way...

 

[TheAtomicDog]

There is a lot of great advice and information in this thread. It sounds like Ksanders is getting ready for an adventure!

I am safety minded generally, especially when other people are involved. I tend to err on the side of safety. Having said that, reading this thread, I believe there has never, in all the history of humankind been anything worthwhile achieved that started with a "review of your insurance policy". I'm sorry, but it makes me sad. What happened? Where have all the adventurers gone? Legislated out of existence in the western world. The meek have inherited the earth, please leave the seas to the bold

Anyway, best of luck Ksanders, regardless of how you go! I admire your spirit and wish you, as they say in Russia, 7 feet under the keel!

 

[O C Diver]

It's funny I was discussing this voyage last night over dinner.

The statement was made that 4,000 miles to La Paz is a Long way!

My response was that I'm not going 4,000 miles.

I am going on a bunch of easy peasy day trips.

This is like one man building his own house or eating an elephant. You do it one bite at a time. I've cruised over 25,000 miles solo in the last 5 years. You wake up each morning and decide if you're going and how far.

Enjoy your cruising adventure! I haven't had a bad one yet.

Ted

 

[Retriever]

I think this post is a good learning opportunity for many of us. Worse weather than forecast, a failed primary bilge pump, difficult-to-source downflooding, fatigue...all with a happy ending!

https://mvdirona.com/2017/05/alarms-at-115am/

 

[Fletcher500]

Good post Atomic. I have been thinking about this topic, and some of the replies and have the same thoughts as you. The ocean is one of our last frontiers that we can explore. The adventurers who set out west across the U.S. by both land and sea a couple hundred years ago would not think much of us these days.

 

[ksanders]

This is like one man building his own house or eating an elephant. You do it one bite at a time. I've cruised over 25,000 miles solo in the last 5 years. You wake up each morning and decide if you're going and how far.

Enjoy your cruising adventure! I haven't had a bad one yet.

Ted

Thanks Ted!

 

[ksanders]

There is a lot of great advice and information in this thread. It sounds like Ksanders is getting ready for an adventure!

I am safety minded generally, especially when other people are involved. I tend to err on the side of safety. Having said that, reading this thread, I believe there has never, in all the history of humankind been anything worthwhile achieved that started with a "review of your insurance policy". I'm sorry, but it makes me sad. What happened? Where have all the adventurers gone? Legislated out of existence in the western world. The meek have inherited the earth, please leave the seas to the bold

Anyway, best of luck Ksanders, regardless of how you go! I admire your spirit and wish you, as they say in Russia, 7 feet under the keel!

Good post Atomic. I have been thinking about this topic, and some of the replies and have the same thoughts as you. The ocean is one of our last frontiers that we can explore. The adventurers who set out west across the U.S. by both land and sea a couple hundred years ago would not think much of us these days.

I have dreamed of this adventure for two decades.

All of the learning
All of the sacrifice
All of the dreams
All of the work

It all comes down to this moment.

It would never even cross my mind not to leave on this adventure, and yes i wonder where have all the adventurers gone!

How would the world look today if we built ships that never left port.

 

[TheAtomicDog]

How would the world look today if we built ships that never left port.

I was thinking about that quote a lot reading this thread..."A ship in harbor is safe, but that is not what ships are built for"

 

[SteveK]

OK, you have ruled out an added crew member. Have you done some dock talk to see if another boat is making the same trip on these first two legs. Hard to imagine your boat will be alone in those waters, though possible. A buddy boat where you agree on check in times for the what if moment, even shore based.
Travel speed faster when alert and daytime, slower otherwise, then 1/2 again slower when you go for a nap.

 

[ksanders]

OK, you have ruled out an added crew member. Have you done some dock talk to see if another boat is making the same trip on these first two legs. Hard to imagine your boat will be alone in those waters, though possible. A buddy boat where you agree on check in times for the what if moment, even shore based.
Travel speed faster when alert and daytime, slower otherwise, then 1/2 again slower when you go for a nap.

That time of year there are plenty of boats out there.

It is the main delivery time for new boats coming to Alaska

Several people I will be in contact with all the time. I have high speed satellite internet with telephone.

Plus i have a spot satellite tracker.

 

[Hippocampus]

Definitely enjoy passagmaking. Happiest at the wheel by myself with no one else up. Have done solo blue water in the past. But yes it’s a different world and totally agree people who have never experienced the joy of passage making now define the world for many of us. My boat is the second largest material asset I have so can’t self insure. Is what it is.
The ocean is one of those vanishing rare places where you can be truly alone. Nothing of man’s creation in sight. No sound, smell or other manmade interference. No planes, cars, other vessels. No help other than your own once you’re off the shelf. Truly alone. For many including myself that’s a huge draw to go to sea.
My kids, prior wife, and many friends could not understand the draw of being alone at sea. Why I would spent so much time and money in preparation. Listened to Dodge Morgan talk about this and personally think it’s a primeval drive in some folks.
I wish KS well and all success. Just wanted him to do this eyes wide open. He’s right. Not much risk to this. Given where’s this is occurring and his comm worst comes to worst he gives a yell and help is on its way.

 

[Crux]

Sounds like a great trip! If you haven't seen it, Jim and Rosy https://m.youtube.com/channel/UCGiFYRcx8AuaqKLu0t4fFgw over at Cruising Sea Venture are completing a non-stop voyage from Prince William Sound south across the Gulf of Alaska...they did strike something during a night portion of trip resulting in a vibration....likely driftwood...likely a prop out of trac...made a speed adjustment to minimize and are continuing on....

Have a great trip!!

 

[Osprey69]

I can't tell you what to do, but I can tell you what I did. I've done several days where they were around or over 24 hours. You need to start in the afternoon (after sleeping) so that the trip through the night is when you are freshest. You definitely want to finish in day light hours. If you're not comfortable running through an entire night, then you need help or it needs to be split up.

The other option is napping. Power naps under 45 minutes work wonders for me. More than 45 minutes at a time screws up my night sleep. Assuming you have a guard zone on the radar and AIS, stopping (just drifting, no anchor, engines off except generator) should be fine. If nothing is on the radar at 20 miles, it's unlikely to reach you in 45 minutes.

Ted

This and pick your weather. Been there/done that and drifting about in what I take are not shipping lanes should be OK given proximity alarms etc. If you can anchor great. If not power naps and if the landfall is at night for whatever reason. Stand off and wait whilst cat-napping till morn.

 

[Fletcher500]

I also use satellite tracking via AIS when I am solo and out of cell range. My wife tracks my position on the Web.

I remember you had installed the satellite system last year which will be a great tool for you as you continue to head south and into Mex waters. I was also considering it, but ended up recently purchasing a Bivy stick that will allow me to send texts when out of cell coverage via satellite.

 

[ksanders]

I also use satellite tracking via AIS when I am solo and out of cell range. My wife tracks my position on the Web.

I remember you had installed the satellite system last year which will be a great tool for you as you continue to head south and into Mex waters. I was also considering it, but ended up recently purchasing a Bivy stick that will allow me to send texts when out of cell coverage via satellite.

I think the new satellite units that allow text messages are wonderful!

I have one of those in addition to the bigger satcom unit.

 

[AKDoug]

That's my plan, texting for weather forecasts and to stay in touch, tracking for those who wish to follow my travels. I followed a friend up the Inside Passage, and was able to give him "almost" real time advice about anchorages and distances to the next decent anchorage. I was impressed, though there is a lag between send and receive due to the satellite intervals passing overhead.

The poor mans answer to satellite system expense...

 

[READY]

Kevin of course we all have different ideas on this. I don't think there has been much attention in this thread about how much easier and safer it would be to have someone along. Sure you can handle it but what happens if issues come up with the boat? Not that this ever happens

My suggestion is don't take an unnecessary risk if you don't have to. Hire a captain or just an experienced deckhand and enjoy the trip. When making these decisions I think about what would I think if I read the Coast Guard accident report? Would I think the captain made the best choices possible? That makes many decisions much easier.

 

[Snapdragon III]

My thoughts on this trip is generally go for it. I think you should plan on taking it slow, and getting a few hours of sleep on the trip one way or another. If the weather is great, just stop the boat during daylight and take a nap for a couple hours. If it is crappy this might be pretty uncomfortable. I would not consider a sea anchor as I think it would be way too hard to bring it in by yourself, and the risk of hurting yourself, or fouling your props would be way greater than just taking a nap with the boat on autopilot at slow speed. My experience of coming home from Hawaii last summer was that night watch, or watch in bad weather is really not doing that much. You can't see **** in the dark, or heavy rain/fog. You could have 6 guys outside scanning the horizon with binoculars and it wouldn't do you any good because its super dark out there. On the other hand, modern radar, and AIS systems are amazing. You can see all the boats in the area miles away on radar, and tens of miles away on AIS. I would experiment with your AIS, and Radar offshore proximity alarms close to home over the next few months in daylight good visibility conditions, and if they work good go for it. Some stuff I would work on before the trip.

-Put extra ratchet straps on your dingy, and anything stored on deck to make triple sure it will not move if the weather goes bad. You do not want to be alone, on the roof in a storm trying to secure stuff.
-Have sandwiches, and non cooking snacks ready to go for the trip
- Have a thermos or two of coffee ready to go
- Have an empty bleach bottle at the helm to piss in.
-Go through the boat a couple times and make sure everything is secure and put away so it won't be sliding all over the place in the waves. This will be especially important if you end up wanting to stop the boat and take a nap, and the boat is slopping around. Having a bunch of plates and mugs sliding back and forth in the cabinets is not very restful.
-Plan it so you will easily arrive in the daylight, should be no problem that time of year.