Military Marinas

[rgano]

So is the problem for a non- retiree or not active duty getting on base without a authorized member the problem?

Yes

 

[psneeld]

Yes

Well there is your problem.

Why should a non active duty or non retiree have access to a military base?

I would work through a veterans group and see if a letter of access from the command be allowed to children of veterans interned at a military cemetery some sort of limited access.

 

[rgano]

As a result of the recent terrorist attack at NAS Pensacola, even though it was by a cleared foreign national, you can bet that the access to the base is TIGHT. New fencing has changed the traffic pattern to divide the base into two separate areas with a guarded gate between them. A back entrance for civilians to access the aviation museum exists, but there is no way they can enter the other half of the base which contains the marina. I can only cite my brother's inability to access the base for a first hand account for a civilian, but let me tell you about attending a burial in the national cemetery a couple of years back. The cortege from the funeral home was met by an armed escort at the gate with escorts front and rear. At the end of the ceremony, I showed the escort my military ID card telling them I wished to visit my parents' grave a couple of hundred feet away and that I would leave on my own later. PERMISSION DENIED. I was told that I WOULD leave the base with the other cars. This regardless of the fact that once off the base I could have just turned around and entered the most sensitive areas of the base on my own. After dealing with base security all over the place for basically my entire life (born into a Navy family), I choose to avoid it when possible, and that includes accessing their marinas.

 

[rgano]

Well there is your problem.

Why should a non active duty or non retiree have access to a military base?

I would work through a veterans group and see if a letter of access from the command be allowed to children of veterans interned at a military cemetery some sort of limited access.

He was previously allowed, and the policy was suddenly changed. I sucked for him.

 

[psneeld]

Well...I haven't seen much of a change in military facilities up and down the East Coast for the last 15 years or so...with and without admitting civilian guests.

Haven't dealt with funerals so that may be a trigger....but its not all that different in facilities that haven't had national level attention due to shooting sprees either.

But typical military...what happens at one facility affects others too.

Heck, I kidded my girlfriend entering Navy Mayport, from now on just put a pizza delivery sign on her roof and she would get waved through no problem....

 

[rgano]

Well...I haven't seen much of a change in military facilities up and down the East Coast for the last 15 years or so...with and without admitting civilian guests.

Haven't dealt with funerals so that may be a trigger....but its not all that different in facilities that haven't had national level attention due to shooting sprees either.

But typical military...what happens at one facility affects others too.

Heck, I kidded my girlfriend entering Navy Mayport, from now on just put a pizza delivery sign on her roof and she would get waved through no problem....

I never had any control over security at a shore base, but I was either in charge of or intimately involved with shipboard security while moored to a pier aboard six different ships, five of them nuclear weapons capable. In the early 70s it was rather simple with a quarterdeck watch of two people, one of whom carried an unloaded .45 pistol and a roving nuclear security patrol also armed with a pistol. The nuclear security response team was aboard too with the ability to be armed with an assortment of machineguns and rifles in mere minutes. Nobody without a military ID was allowed aboard, and even then, a point of contact had to be called to the quarterdeck to escort non-crew personnel. Security badges were issued. A bit later on the quarterdeck pistol was carried with a loaded clip inserted with the same military ID and escort requirements. When I left my last ship in 1986, pretty much the same measures were in place with the addition of a sniper fully suited up in body armor hidden in the upper works backing up the quarterdeck. Not all ships nuclear capable ships did the sniper thing back then. Nowadays, I dunno, but suffice it to say security is constantly evolving and never likely to be exactly the same from ship to ship and from base to base. To get on the USAF base here, we had to go to the security office and present our ID cards to be registered into the automated system used at the gate via a scanner by the military guards, and fingerprints were involved. There is no such requirement at the Navy base across town where we just flash the ID card at the civilian guard. Why? The USAF base has fully armed fighters aboard while the Navy base housed the dive training center, a research center, and the local Coast Guard. So big differences due to missions involved will be found from base to base and ship to ship. A pizza delivery guy can drive on some bases, but when he gets to the ship where he is delivering, he has to pass through a security point on the pier well away from the ship. The Sailor receiving the pizza probably has to go to the pier security pint to get his pie. On the odd chance the policy is to let him approach the ship (now on foot), the quarterdeck will be forewarned via radio, and who knows, he may well be in the crosshairs of a sniper's scope all the way up the pier.

True story follows; I was there.

A senior officer on a non-nuke capable ship across the pier from us once decided that he could drive his car to his XO parking place alongside his ship without so much as a howdy do to our unarmed pier security point. Our Executive Officer (XO), a rank higher than this officer, quickly went across to the ship and called the offending officer to his quarter deck and told him to never do that again. He then directed the offender's attention to the barely visible helmet in the upper works of our ship and the US Marine under it holding his scoped rifle on the center nass of the guy while telling him next time things might turn out differently.

 

[psneeld]

OK...but getting to non secure places on bases seem to be nowhere near the problem you are making it out to be.

Some reservations, you can get to non secure areas....commisaries, exchanges, morale areas without even going through a gate.

I was security officer for a couple USCG installations, one during the first gulf War where terrorism threats were highly elevated...even then my recommendations were downplayed except for aviation ramp areas and ship berthing areas.

Some military MWR facilities I have utilized and others by friends still come highly rated for enjoyment.

 

[rgano]

OK...but getting to non secure places on bases seem to be nowhere near the problem you are making it out to be.

Some reservations, you can get to non secure areas....commisaries, exchanges, morale areas without even going through a gate.

I was security officer for a couple USCG installations, one during the first gulf War where terrorism threats were highly elevated...even then my recommendations were downplayed except for aviation ramp areas and ship berthing areas.

Some military MWR facilities I have utilized and others by friends still come highly rated for enjoyment.

Pensacola moved the commissary and hospital off base many decades ago, but of course the marina and national cemetery remained behind guarded gates which have apparently become more restrictive in the last year or two.

One should enjoy all the MWR facilities they can because they are earned benefits. There is a fine balance MWR managers always must play between access to members and family and access to those who never served. Too easy access can be a problem. I lived at the Coronado Navy marina for three years. Gates wide open to the adjacent highway, and all sorts of folks wandered in there.

 

[slowgoesit]

He was previously allowed, and the policy was suddenly changed. I sucked for him.

Think you're telling us a little too much information there . . .

 

[Leatherneck]

Well...I haven't seen much of a change in military facilities up and down the East Coast for the last 15 years or so...with and without admitting civilian guests.

Haven't dealt with funerals so that may be a trigger....but its not all that different in facilities that haven't had national level attention due to shooting sprees either.

But typical military...what happens at one facility affects others too.

Heck, I kidded my girlfriend entering Navy Mayport, from now on just put a pizza delivery sign on her roof and she would get waved through no problem....

FWIW the pizza companies near Pax River NAS have to have drivers who will deliver pizza on base to get approved by base security. The companies need to make sure that they have at least one "vetted" driver who handles the on-base deliveries. So I guess they have closed that loophole.

 

[IronZebra]

I asked same question back in 2018. https://www.trawlerforum.com/forums/s58/military-marinas-38568.html

Here are some good links that came from that:
https://travelingwiththetompkins.com/military-marinas/
https://www.navymwr.org/programs/marinas
https://www.cnic.navy.mil/ffr/fleet_readiness/food_and_beverage_programs/marinas_and_sailing.html