Hello from a newbie on the Chesapeake

[Marin]

Just curious why "wanna Be" windows ( aka West Coast Windows) don't work "up here"?

Because they are butt-ugly and we try to prevent the importation of ugly boats to the area. So far we've been relatively successful although the occasional ugly boat does manage to slip through the filter every now and then.

 

[Nick14]

Beauty is always in the eye of the beholder. Some of us think reverse rake windows are the epitome of beauty in a boat, and wouldn't have it any other way.

 

[Marin]

Some of us think reverse rake windows are the epitome of beauty in a boat....

That's fine. Just keep it out of the PNW and we'll all be happy. People up here tend to laugh and point and make snide comments when they see some poor sod driving a boat with wannabe windows.

That happened to the guy I mentioned earlier who bought one of the first ATs and gave me and my friend a tour of the boat when he showed up at Sucia Island marine park dock with it. He ended up being laughed off the dock (not by me and my friend, though. We wouldn't do that.) So about dusk he slipped his lines and slunk out of the bay.

We heard later that he'd traded in the AT for an NT but we haven't seen him since to confirm that.

I hate to see people subjected to that sort of thing.

 

[deckofficer]

Sounds like the dock mice in the PNW haven't graduated past the school yard bully stage. I sure don't understand the division of forward vs aft slant of the bridge windows. The smallest vessel I served on was a break bulk at 499' and our bridge windows were vertical, so I guess I wouldn't be accepted by either camp.

 

[healhustler]

Don't get caught up in the debate about wannabe windows, youz guys. I have the purest example of wannabe windows on this forum. They are unnecessary, grossly oversized, extreme in their angle, but so helpful in our style of cruising. We love 'em. The inspiration for them came from a guy standing on the dock in Seattle and watching all the boats trying to wipe the bird crap off their windshields. The style originated there and were called PiNWinds (presumably short for Pacific Northwest windows).

 

[Nick14]

"Wannabe windows"? It's such a small thing that is mostly a personal aesthetic taste, which many boats have - not only American Tug, but Selene, Helmsman, Sundowner, and others. I trust you're joking, both about the hypothetical small-mindedness of people who would poke fun of others over something as irrelevant as windows, and about someone who would do something as drastic as sell a boat just because some insecure morons made immature comments at a dock. I would hope people left any nonsense like that behind in grade school.

Boats, and boat styles, are very personal. Everyone has their own tastes, with few absolute 'rights' or 'wrongs'. Being out on the water in any boat should be celebrated, and accepted by everyone as part of the brotherhood of the sea.

 

[healhustler]

Sorry, Nick. The subject of forward raked windows has been a thing of real entertainment for a couple of years....that is, quite polarized opinions on the advantages and disadvantages of both. It's just foolishness going on, and lets face it,...ya gotta be part foolish to have a boat.

As for me, I think your windows are great, and go perfectly with the boat.

 

[Moonstruck]

Boats, and boat styles, are very personal. Everyone has their own tastes, with few absolute 'rights' or 'wrongs'. Being out on the water in any boat should be celebrated, and accepted by everyone as part of the brotherhood of the sea.

Nick, of course, you are 100% correct. This comes from a "wannabe" Sabre driver. There will never be everyone that likes anything. All boats are a compromise. You give and you get. The wannabe stuff has turned into an inside joke on TF. Some don't appreciate the dark humor, but it's part of it.

You have a great boat, and I for one would be proud to own and cruise it. There is no reason to take a back seat with that boat. You will get years of enjoyment. Welcome to the forum, and please keep us up on your cruising.

Hope to see you on the Chesapeake. We have it on the schedule for the 2015 season.

 

[Marin]

The smallest vessel I served on was a break bulk at 499' and our bridge windows were vertical, so I guess I wouldn't be accepted by either camp.

You'd be accepted in mine. Vertical pilothouse/helm station windows look great on the right style of vessel.

 

[hconnell]

Hello from another newbie in Florida

 

[deckofficer]

Welcome to TF hconnell. What orientation are your bridge windows? lol

 

[markpierce]

From some angles, the Coot's wannabe windows aren't readily apparent. Best to orient one's boat either directly away or toward Marin.

 

[Marin]

From some angles, the Coot's wannabe windows aren't readily apparent. Best to orient one's boat either directly away or toward Marin.

"Away" is what you want because that will mean the boat in question is leaving.

 

[Nick14]

I had no idea that orientation of bridge windows inspired such passionate feelings! I can't wait to see what happens when we talk about things like engine brands or hull designs, or the really important stuff like hull colors, and maybe even <gasp!> 2 strand vs 3 strand dock lines!

 

[deckofficer]

Hey Nick, on the Cruiser's Forum a hot topic is anchors. And of course the mono vs multi debates also go strong.

 

[THD]

Endurance--to keep the passion going: "What kind of anchor do you have?"

 

[markpierce]

hull colors[/B], ...

Dark hulls rule! Better to see in the fog. Else wise, beautiful. Besides, dark hulls are typical of "working boats" while white hulls are generally the rule for cruise ships (except Holland America's). Can't understand the under-current of disdain for cruise ships when the majority of recreational cruisers look like them!

 

[markpierce]

"Away" is what you want because that will mean the boat in question is leaving.

So, you fear my armored hull?!

 

[Marin]

So, you fear my armored hull?!

Nope. Just always glad to see another boat departing the area.

 

[Marin]

I had no idea that orientation of bridge windows inspired such passionate feelings!

Some people like them, some don't from an aesthetic standpoint. I understand the benefits of their design on things like rescue boats and open ocean boats like commercial crabbers and where they can be dealing with really nasty conditions. But on a recreational coastal cruiser I think all they accomplish is to ruin the lines of the boat.

This is one reason I totally prefer the NT to the AT. The NT looks the way I think a tug-style should look. As does a Victory Tug. I feel the same way about the Selene--- pretty nice looking boat until they ruined its entire appearance, in my opinion, by using wannabe windows on it.

Every recreational production boat I've seen with wannabe windows has a clown-like, popeyed appearance which to me totally overpowers whatever good design aesthetics the rest of the boat might have.

Healhustler from time to time has done his Photoshop/Illustrator magic to remove the wannabe windows from a particular production recreational cruiser that has them and replaced them with vertical or conventionally-raked forward windows. In every instance where he's done this, I've felt the aesthetics of the boat was vastly improved.

It's not that bif of a deal with regards to the operation of a boat. Its handling, windage, speed, efficiency or lack thereof, maneuverability, and maintainability are not affected by which way the forward windows happen to slant. It is totally an aesthetic thing, and to someone like me who places a high value on aesthetics, be it a car, boat or toaster, reverse-slant pilothouse windows don't have any.

Subjects like anchors, engines, rope types, etc. actually matter in the operation of a cruising boat. Windows don't. But they can contribute a lot toward whether or not a particular boat looks good to us or not, and this in turn can have an influence on whether or not we would buy a particular boat. My wife and I, for example, would never buy a boat with wannabe windows regardless of the boat's other attributes simply because we don't want to own a boat that looks like that. Other people think they look great.

 

[Peter B]

Guys, Marin just loves yanking chains, and people with boats with forward slanting windows always bite so hard he can't resist.
Actually, I quite like them on the right boat. I agree they don't suit a fast vessel, even though they probably don't contribute much wind resistance in reality, (not at boat planing speeds which at the size we are talking about = a max of ~ 30 kn), but they look as if they would. But for a hull speed or slower semi-planer they are fine in my eyes, whereas vertical windows to me personally look rather 'olde worlde'. Sort of like the little tug that could.
Healhustler even has a photoshop version of what my Clipper would look like with them, and I could live with it for sure....Healhustler...I seem to have lost it, do you still have it saved...?

 

[Nick14]

There's nothing uglier than bigotry against slanting windows (in either direction... slants go both ways, and then who is the real wannabe?). Let's not get started on the proper placement and rules for flying ensigns, pennants, and burgees... blood would be shed and lives certainly lost.

I try to live by simple rules. Blondes, brunettes, redheads... all good. Politicians.... all bad.

 

[healhustler]

Healhustler even has a photoshop version of what my Clipper would look like with them, and I could live with it for sure....Healhustler...I seem to have lost it, do you still have it saved...?

I dunno, but if you send me the photo I used for the demo, I'll see if I can find it in the archives. Still, in defense of all those who love forward raked winshields, I submit the following example to those who don't, and dare them to say it doesn't entirely enhance the boats sleek lines and unobtrusive flow. (Not photoshoped, by the way).

 

[Nick14]

Could you imagine that boat with anything but a forward-raked windshield?

 

[markpierce]

Forward-raked windows significantly increases interior volume.

 

[Nsail]

Forward-raked windows significantly increases interior volume.

No, they don't increase the interior volumn of anything. What they do is change your working, or, instrument space. If you need to hang instruments, they're great. But, on most boats, if you need working space for charts, laptops, etc. they're a major detriment.

Personally, I'm a big fan of forward raked windows, but there is a trade off with either setup.

 

[markpierce]

No, they don't increase the interior volumn of anything. What they do is change your working, or, instrument space. If you need to hang instruments, they're great. But, on most boats, if you need working space for charts, laptops, etc. they're a major detriment..

One doesn't need working space beyond arms' reach, and it is definitely less claustrophobic with forward-slant windows.

 

[Marin]

One doesn't need working space beyond arms' reach, and it is definitely less claustrophobic with forward-slant windows.

Hmmm.... First photo doesn't look very claustrophobic to me. Second photo does, though.

 

[markpierce]

Hmmm.... First photo doesn't look very claustrophobic to me. Second photo does, though.

... Marin, your GB has larger windows and skinny frames.

 

[deckofficer]

... Marin, your GB has larger windows and skinny frames.

Who will take the girl with the skinny legs?