GB32 Woodie Under Contract: Lots of Questions :)

[thebruce]

Thanks so much all!

I took the advice of one of the earlier posts and confirmed with the surveyor if he spots anything during the on water survey we will cancel the haul out and save a couple bucks. It should be a great learning experience either way. He's supposedly one of the best wood boat guys in the Bay Area and knows GBs well.

I will let you know how the survey turns out. Ive now recalibrated and expecting the worst but holding out a small sliver of hope. Lets see.

 

[thebruce]

To the OP.

$12K for a rough boat, big project.

Or

$19K for a boat that is much closer to ready to cruise. Grand Banks - $19,500 (Bainbridge Island)

Of course it's impossible to tell from pic on Craigslist but she looks well cared for and squared away. The biggest concern I see from the posting is 7400 hrs on the main. With your mechanical experience this should not be a concern. Yes, she's up north, but the trip down the coast in the right weather is not a problem.

Thanks! I contacted them.

 

[Brisyboy]

Time to draw a line under this one?

It has been an interesting thread (so far) but I think "run away", or words to that effect have been the general summary of the posts so far. There have been a couple of "just do it" but these have been qualified heavily.
The thread originator surely has enough info to make an educated decision - the danger is if the negative is continually presented, it may have a reverse effect - he may move into "I`ll show um" mode and buy it - I`m just not sure what he will be showing us though

 

[thebruce]

Time to draw a line under this one?

It has been an interesting thread (so far) but I think "run away", or words to that effect have been the general summary of the posts so far. There have been a couple of "just do it" but these have been qualified heavily.
The thread originator surely has enough info to make an educated decision - the danger is if the negative is continually presented, it may have a reverse effect - he may move into "I`ll show um" mode and buy it - I`m just not sure what he will be showing us though

I told you, im an idiot but not a moron

 

[Portage_Bay]

I told you, im an idiot but not a moron

That is one of the essential qualities for owning any boat. You gotta be idiot enough to overlook all the costs and downsides to go for the dream. And smart enough to figure it out as you go along.

 

[Art]

I told you, im an idiot but not a moron

Bruce - I've got faith in ya! You've been told enough pit falls regarding an old woodie in the posts of this thread. Maybe, Just Maybe... this inexpensive woodie you are contemplating the purchase of has been well cared for, still has good bones and can make you a nice pleasure cruiser.

On the other hand maybe not. From the posts here of experienced boat luvers you have considerable [I believe new to you] high points and low points to look for in this GB woodie you have profiled.

I do want to add another not so uplifting distinction regarding the ownership old wood boats; although the general context of what I'm about to say was already mention in posts on this thread.

Look Into Your [and most Wood Boats'] Past, Present and Future:

First - The Past - - - 50 years ago [1970 and seemingly forever before then] wood pleasure boat accepting marinas [also repair boatyards] and their wood boat knowledgeable artisans [as well as other generally good wood boat workers] were prevalent. Hauling a woodie for botton work was the norm. Insurance for a woodie was no problem and readily available. In other words... wood boats were then in vogue for ownership and enjoyment with plenty of ways to care for them. During those decades fiberglass construction took over the market. Slowly but surely during the 5 past decades... in general... wood boat construction became a thing of the past. And, due to the extreme lastability of well built fiberglass boats... wood boats pretty much fell out of favor in the retail-purchase [vanilla minded] boating community.

Second - The Present - - - Most wood boats are now quite old. Many have not been well cared for. Many have had their wood and fasteners become not so good due to age and weathering [i.e. metal corrosion and wood rot]. Most require a lot of work if an owner wants to bring them back to their former glory of beauty and seaworthiness.

Third - The Future - - - Boat you buy will likely be yours for at least a few years and maybe longer. Each year it is getting harder to locate marinas who will dock a woodie. Most wood boat artisans are past their prime [to say the least]... or have passed onto after-life adventures! For many reasons... marinas and boatyards are more and more refusing to even haul a woodie for bottom work. Insurance is difficult to locate and can be quite expensive. As years pass by these items regarding old wood boats will consistently become more pronounced and more severe. Eventually owning an old wood boat will become feasible only for those who have private docking and some way to self-haul their boat for maintenance, Then there's the insurance aspect... IMO old wood boats have seen their day, done their duty, and such as nearly all other constructed items from now on will find their rest.

Be very careful what you purchase at seemingly a great price... it can kick you in the arse for years to come. Your posts make me thing the GB you are looking at is most likely an Arse-Kicker!

Best Luck!

 

[NUTIN FANCY TOO]

Love the passion. You guys are great. Thats why forums like this are such a resource.

I'm still taking all the feedback in right now. Im honestly a bit surprised on how negative the comments are. I came in expecting a 60/40 split. I figured there would be a small GB woody fan club who told me dont listen to the haters. But...the fact im seeing a 90/10 split from knowledgable owners does give me pause and makes me re-calibrate. So thank you for that.

And I also get it. We get the same type of posts on the Porsche forums from the newb who found the diamond in the rough. People see 1) a newb with 1 post, 2) what sounds like a wreck and 3) a woodie and what immediately comes to mind is "this guy is an f'n moron and going to get himself in trouble". I've been there and I know you are all looking out for my best interest.

In my defense, im certainly an idiot but im not an moron. The projects are half the fun. I'm one of those people who enjoys taking things apart, researching them for days and weeks until ive built the confidence and skills to rebuild it better than new. It's part of the pride of ownership. Other guys just want to get in a go. Thats not me.

But im also not some DIY hero who is a glutton for never ending punishment. I love nothing more than finding a good hack to get the best ROI for each job in terms of cost, effort and outcome. Ive started a couple companies and this is fundamental to all value creation.

On the other hand, some guys consider it a badge of honor on how much they spend to maintain their hobby. These guys either lack the intellectual curiosity or patience so gladly pay the idiot tax.

So...my "hope" is that boats are like cars. I could easily bring my car to the dealer and wont leave without paying at least $4k. Or I can sleuth out who the good indy mechanics are and pay $1.5k. Or I can spend a week of research and $150 in parts and do it myself over a weekend - and be proud of that accomplishment vs pissed off I just burned another $4k. If this doesn't hold true for boats, by all means, please let me know. A big part of my equation is riding on this.

Further, I want to challenge some of the earlier points raised. Im not intending to be belligerent or combative, because they were all very useful. So please dont take offense. The point is to test my assumptions and understand where my blind spots are.

1 - one post suggested I buy a GB32 fiberglass boat listed for $56k. That boat has the same rot issues in the cabin and flybridge, correct? Dont all GBs suffer the same thing? So wouldn't I have an extra $44k to make a pristine woodie? Are hull/structural issues that pervasive and expensive on woodies to justify spending $44k more?

2 - another post said I could easily spend $30k on it. I dont disagree over the long haul. Im seeing GB32 woodies go for 20-50k on the west coast. So lets say I spend $30k, made it into a pristine GB32 and only get $30k for it after 5 years. So im out 12k. All boats are depreciating assets. If I bought a brand new Protector I'd lose a hell of a lot more than $12k over 5 years, right?

3 - another post said I was looking at hundreds of hours of work. I agree. But lets break that down:

- Sanding and scraping. Yea its not a fun job. Luckily it doesn't require a rocket science degree so can be hired out at $30/hr. Is a yard at $120/hr somehow 4x better at sanding? Further, the guy charging $30/hr is paying his guys $12/hr, so there's a lot of margin in one of the most unskilled areas of boat maintenance, right?

- Paint and varnish. This is the easier, and rewarding part. Its all the work getting to this point thats sucks, right? For example, I know it costs $3k to hire out to get all the brightwork done. But most of that time is waiting for paint to dry. If you just pay 2-3 guys to scrape and sand over one day its like 24hrs of labor max, or $720. Then for me its only 1-2hrs per coat over the next week or two, right? So...I could a) pay $3k to have somebody do it for me, b) spend a couple grueling weekends as some DIY hero, or c) split the middle and hire out the hard stuff and focus on the fun stuff, at 1/4 the price. Is my math wrong, or am I missing something (im asking not projecting).

- Mechanical. Not afraid. Will take some time to learn diesels but im going take a leap and say its far simpler and more comfortable to work on than a 911 engine. Ive gone through the engine room and the most daunting project looks like cutting the tanks out.

- Interior cushions and canvas. Yes im sure I can easily spend $4k on just the interior. But I can also buy the fabric myself and bring it to a guy who knows a guy that does good work and charges 1/3 the marine shop idiot tax, right? That may take a few weeks of digging, but somebody knows this guy and the effort pays for itself right? Further, a $50k fiberglass GB will still have a dated interior...and Im gonna pay an extra $4k just in sales tax on that boat.

- Rot fix above the water line. Yes, this certainly concerns me. But all fiberglass GBs suffer from the same issue so if im not comfortable with this risk and dont learn how to repair it, im much better off buying a Boston whaler, right? Ive been binging on YouTube videos and it doesn't look like brain surgery. Its scary digging holes in your boat, but so is pulling a transmission off a car the first time. The second time its just 16 bolts.

- Rot and structural issues below the waterline. Yup, this scares me. This is moving into the unknown on costs, time, probabilities, etc. I dont have enough information here. Whats the maintenance schedule, risk factors, likely issues you run into, etc. All I know is there are yards in the delta that focus on wood boats and are more affordable. So this requires more digging and would be the primary go/no go line on the survey.

- Lastly, one of my assumptions is I can stage these out to a project every quarter. Q1 is stripping back the cabin, flybridge and brightwork, Q1-Q2 is the interior, Q2 is the engine room, Q2-Q3 is priority 1 engine work, Q3-Q4 is re-caulking the decks, Q4-Q5 is the topsides, Q5-Q8is the ongoing mechanical and electrical upgrades. And then over 2 years you have a pristine boat you can be proud of.

However, if its more likely im going to have 5 urgent projects all at the same time, yes, this feels like a losing battle I dont want to get into. So in your experience, where does it fall?


Again, please dont take these as an attack on any of your suggestions. They were all very useful. Im just trying to test some assumptions to understand if this is or isn't the right project for me.

Thanks again!


Ps - One other tidbit I just learned on the boat is the guy aparently took it from SF to Oregon and back last year. That doesn't seem like a trip somebody takes if they aren't confident in their boat.

I to,am surprised at all the negativity. I'm a "wood boat nut". Nut being the operative word.lol
But,that being said, take most of this with a grain of salt. There are many people, on many different types of forums, that become an expert simply because they own a certain product. This does not make one an expert. Matter of fact,I'm sure there are no experts on here,or,actually, on any forum.
To me,and mind you,this is only my opinion, there needs to be a different forum for wooden Grand Banks. To many plastic boat folks,who "think"they know all about woodies, simply from all the horror stories that they have heard thru the years.
And then there are the "weekend warrior"boaters,the "armchair Captains ",and the "Saturday Surveyors ". That probably makes up 60-70% of your 90%
It sounds to me like you have a solid plan,and a sound mind,plus,you evidently have the funds to do the repairs.
So,go get your boat, and,if you need any advice,send me a p.m.,we can exchange phone numbers, and go from there.

 

[rsn48]

This past summer my boat came out of refit after 20 months on the hard. Someone earlier suggested you might have to spend $30,000 on the boat. I laughed out loud at this figure. What I spent I could have easily have bought three or more Tesla's and still had money left in the bank.

Working and bringing back to life a woodie such as the Grand Banks is a labour of love with almost zero economic practicality. The boat I have now is great and well suited for my style of cruising, but it was economic foolishness. But at 72 if I can get some great years of cruising in and staying on the boat at the marina for weeks at a time, I have a life style I enjoy.

My suggestion is look for something in the $125,000 used mark and sink some money into that boat. I know $125,000 is a far cry from $12,000 but is a low figure if you go ahead with your plans.

What I did was gut the entire boat, engine/leg, fuel and water tanks, anything and all electrical torn out except for three sets of wires. New everything was put in and anything that was left, the fridge and windlass, were less than two years old at the beginning of the refit.

I put all new everything in as I didn't want to be nickel and dimed to death as repairs came due. All new electronics were added, and a host of other changes. In essences I have a new boat in an old boat structure.

Now is the time to replace stuff while the boat is going through its refit paces.

 

[NUTIN FANCY TOO]

This past summer my boat came out of refit after 20 months on the hard. Someone earlier suggested you might have to spend $30,000 on the boat. I laughed out loud at this figure. What I spent I could have easily have bought three or more Tesla's and still had money left in the bank.

Working and bringing back to life a woodie such as the Grand Banks is a labour of love with almost zero economic practicality. The boat I have now is great and well suited for my style of cruising, but it was economic foolishness. But at 72 if I can get some great years of cruising in and staying on the boat at the marina for weeks at a time, I have a life style I enjoy.

My suggestion is look for something in the $125,000 used mark and sink some money into that boat. I know $125,000 is a far cry from $12,000 but is a low figure if you go ahead with your plans.

What I did was gut the entire boat, engine/leg, fuel and water tanks, anything and all electrical torn out except for three sets of wires. New everything was put in and anything that was left, the fridge and windlass, were less than two years old at the beginning of the refit.

I put all new everything in as I didn't want to be nickel and dimed to death as repairs came due. All new electronics were added, and a host of other changes. In essences I have a new boat in an old boat structure.

Now is the time to replace stuff while the boat is going through its refit paces.

Lordy Lordy. You have more money than you've got sense. Lol
There is absolutely no reason to go that far.
Evidently, I'm in a club with a bunch of Thurston Howe The Thirds,and I'm a Gilligan.
The way y'all talk about spending money,is like y'all own a bank.(some probably do).
Happiness is not spending a small fortune on a boat. Happiness is getting you a nice boat,that suits YOUR needs,not the millionaires clubs.
We do not ever own these old grand wooden ladis. We simply possess them for a time, and pass them on to the next person.
Y'all slack off of this guy.
Hmmmm,come to think of it,I'll bet ya that there are a few boat brokers on here,trying to sell him a boat.
And,as a final thought, i am going to look into the idea of having a WOODEN GRAND BANKS forum,to give people that truly love and want a woodie. Maybe that way they can get some constructive feedback

 

[Northern Spy]

Yes. Sometimes I think that Thurston Howell III (and Lovie) are alive and well on the forum.

Maybe that's why my original avatar was Gilligan.

 

[alfamike]

Your stated $$$ expectations are way low on your estimates on boat repair costs

I have done it all with cars & rebuilds & restorations, etc & also done the boat equilevent of same thing & You can't compair a car repair to a boat repair.

Compairing apples to oranges. NOT even remotely the same thing.

Your stated $$$ expectations to fix this wooden GB are way low on your estimates on boat repair costs.

Do what you want, but remember we warned ya.

You can easily get $ 150,000.oo wrapped up in this boat & $ 200,000.oo is not out of the realm of possibility just in the first 5 years of ownership, & then that will still only sell for $ 12 K, if your lucky.

Plus it never stops, after it is all fixed, (And it really never is, you just don't see it yet), a few years down the road you get to start same thing all over again.

I wish some one had told me what this thread has told you, & I can say I would be a lot richer if I had this info back in the old days.

Don't walk - RUN away from this cheap boat !

"My Mama Told Me - you better shop around !"

Good luck.

Alfa Mike

 

[Art]

Love the passion. You guys are great. Thats why forums like this are such a resource.

I'm still taking all the feedback in right now. Im honestly a bit surprised on how negative the comments are. I came in expecting a 60/40 split. I figured there would be a small GB woody fan club who told me dont listen to the haters. But...the fact im seeing a 90/10 split from knowledgable owners does give me pause and makes me re-calibrate. So thank you for that.

And I also get it. We get the same type of posts on the Porsche forums from the newb who found the diamond in the rough. People see 1) a newb with 1 post, 2) what sounds like a wreck and 3) a woodie and what immediately comes to mind is "this guy is an f'n moron and going to get himself in trouble". I've been there and I know you are all looking out for my best interest.

In my defense, im certainly an idiot but im not an moron. The projects are half the fun. I'm one of those people who enjoys taking things apart, researching them for days and weeks until ive built the confidence and skills to rebuild it better than new. It's part of the pride of ownership. Other guys just want to get in a go. Thats not me.

But im also not some DIY hero who is a glutton for never ending punishment. I love nothing more than finding a good hack to get the best ROI for each job in terms of cost, effort and outcome. Ive started a couple companies and this is fundamental to all value creation.

On the other hand, some guys consider it a badge of honor on how much they spend to maintain their hobby. These guys either lack the intellectual curiosity or patience so gladly pay the idiot tax.

So...my "hope" is that boats are like cars. I could easily bring my car to the dealer and wont leave without paying at least $4k. Or I can sleuth out who the good indy mechanics are and pay $1.5k. Or I can spend a week of research and $150 in parts and do it myself over a weekend - and be proud of that accomplishment vs pissed off I just burned another $4k. If this doesn't hold true for boats, by all means, please let me know. A big part of my equation is riding on this.

Further, I want to challenge some of the earlier points raised. Im not intending to be belligerent or combative, because they were all very useful. So please dont take offense. The point is to test my assumptions and understand where my blind spots are.

1 - one post suggested I buy a GB32 fiberglass boat listed for $56k. That boat has the same rot issues in the cabin and flybridge, correct? Dont all GBs suffer the same thing? So wouldn't I have an extra $44k to make a pristine woodie? Are hull/structural issues that pervasive and expensive on woodies to justify spending $44k more?

2 - another post said I could easily spend $30k on it. I dont disagree over the long haul. Im seeing GB32 woodies go for 20-50k on the west coast. So lets say I spend $30k, made it into a pristine GB32 and only get $30k for it after 5 years. So im out 12k. All boats are depreciating assets. If I bought a brand new Protector I'd lose a hell of a lot more than $12k over 5 years, right?

3 - another post said I was looking at hundreds of hours of work. I agree. But lets break that down:

- Sanding and scraping. Yea its not a fun job. Luckily it doesn't require a rocket science degree so can be hired out at $30/hr. Is a yard at $120/hr somehow 4x better at sanding? Further, the guy charging $30/hr is paying his guys $12/hr, so there's a lot of margin in one of the most unskilled areas of boat maintenance, right?

- Paint and varnish. This is the easier, and rewarding part. Its all the work getting to this point thats sucks, right? For example, I know it costs $3k to hire out to get all the brightwork done. But most of that time is waiting for paint to dry. If you just pay 2-3 guys to scrape and sand over one day its like 24hrs of labor max, or $720. Then for me its only 1-2hrs per coat over the next week or two, right? So...I could a) pay $3k to have somebody do it for me, b) spend a couple grueling weekends as some DIY hero, or c) split the middle and hire out the hard stuff and focus on the fun stuff, at 1/4 the price. Is my math wrong, or am I missing something (im asking not projecting).

- Mechanical. Not afraid. Will take some time to learn diesels but im going take a leap and say its far simpler and more comfortable to work on than a 911 engine. Ive gone through the engine room and the most daunting project looks like cutting the tanks out.

- Interior cushions and canvas. Yes im sure I can easily spend $4k on just the interior. But I can also buy the fabric myself and bring it to a guy who knows a guy that does good work and charges 1/3 the marine shop idiot tax, right? That may take a few weeks of digging, but somebody knows this guy and the effort pays for itself right? Further, a $50k fiberglass GB will still have a dated interior...and Im gonna pay an extra $4k just in sales tax on that boat.

- Rot fix above the water line. Yes, this certainly concerns me. But all fiberglass GBs suffer from the same issue so if im not comfortable with this risk and dont learn how to repair it, im much better off buying a Boston whaler, right? Ive been binging on YouTube videos and it doesn't look like brain surgery. Its scary digging holes in your boat, but so is pulling a transmission off a car the first time. The second time its just 16 bolts.

- Rot and structural issues below the waterline. Yup, this scares me. This is moving into the unknown on costs, time, probabilities, etc. I dont have enough information here. Whats the maintenance schedule, risk factors, likely issues you run into, etc. All I know is there are yards in the delta that focus on wood boats and are more affordable. So this requires more digging and would be the primary go/no go line on the survey.

- Lastly, one of my assumptions is I can stage these out to a project every quarter. Q1 is stripping back the cabin, flybridge and brightwork, Q1-Q2 is the interior, Q2 is the engine room, Q2-Q3 is priority 1 engine work, Q3-Q4 is re-caulking the decks, Q4-Q5 is the topsides, Q5-Q8is the ongoing mechanical and electrical upgrades. And then over 2 years you have a pristine boat you can be proud of.

However, if its more likely im going to have 5 urgent projects all at the same time, yes, this feels like a losing battle I dont want to get into. So in your experience, where does it fall?


Again, please dont take these as an attack on any of your suggestions. They were all very useful. Im just trying to test some assumptions to understand if this is or isn't the right project for me.

Thanks again!


Ps - One other tidbit I just learned on the boat is the guy aparently took it from SF to Oregon and back last year. That doesn't seem like a trip somebody takes if they aren't confident in their boat.

Heck, Bruce

Seems you know enough [i.e. we've amply explained the lows and highs] so you can figure things out. Tell us all about it as time evolves.

Over and out! - Art

 

[rainydayfisher]

My 2 cents

Peter - this needs to be made into a t-shirt. Best quote of the thread

I also found the prior owners Facebook page. It looks like he really did use this boat everyday: https://www.facebook.com/BarbaryGhost/

Back to my car references, I know from experience the garage queens are the ones that bight u in the ass. Does the same hold true for GBs?

I think it's great that you want to preserve one of these fine vessels. I'm right there with you as I am just about to take ownership of this GB 32
https://www.yachtworld.com/boats/1967/grand-banks-32-sedan-3685210/. Which the owner agreed to the same price you are currently under contract for your boat. I'm still very nervous about my choice but the boat has lived 90% of its life in the same boathouse and is very structurally sound. The PNW tends to treat wood better than southern climates do.

There are good wood boats to be found out there but I would sadly not count your intended purchase as one of them. Unless you are retired or independently wealthy and are in for a herculean effort like Leo Sampson is with Tally Ho. I would definitely back away from that boat.

 

[twistedtree]

Back to the original poster....


What are you looking for?


Obviously a boat, we got that.


And presumably you are expressly looking for a project?


Or are you looking for an affordable way to get a boat, and willing to do some work to keep costs down?


Or are you expressly looking for a wooden boat project?


I think being clear on this will go a long way towards selecting the right boat.


I think the objective value of a lot of older boats is actually a negative number equal to the cost to scrap them. The exception are boats that have been consistently kept up, but unfortunately that becomes less and less likely as the years tick by. I say a negative value because whatever you pay is really just a token value, and any money invested is unlikely to increase the market value. And what you sell it for will be another token value. It's kind of a hot potato being passed around until someone gets stuck with it and has to scrap it, paying out the cost to do so.

 

[SteveK]

Thanks! I contacted them.

Did you buy this one, the posting has expired.
waiting to hear what the survey says. Was following along and surprised you did not post a link to the boat for sale in post one.
Anyone can own a tupperware boat, it takes a unique person to own a wood boat. Make that 89 against and 11 go for it.

 

[Simi 60]

You can easily get $ 150,000.oo wrapped up in this boat & $ 200,000.oo is not out of the realm of possibility just in the first 5 years of ownership, & then that will still only sell for $ 12 K, if your lucky.

Easily?

Only if you are an idiot with too much money which, unfortunately there seems to be no shortage of these days.

Sensible people with half a brain would get to a point and go " yeah, well that ain't working and lesson learnt" and move on after dropping an extra $10k or less.

Pretty sure there was a flock of naysayers saying we were mad for buying 60 ft of timber on the cheap yet here we are, over 4 years of daily use, living the dream and zero regrets.
Extra expenditure has essentially been solar panels, batteries and inverter/charger making her suitable for off marina living.
The quick $9000 including paid professional to do electrical.
Would have needed same on plastic or metal.

Fixing and repairing bad timber, paint and mechanical over and above general maintenance has been a few thousand at best..

 

[NUTIN FANCY TOO]

Did you buy this one, the posting has expired.
waiting to hear what the survey says. Was following along and surprised you did not post a link to the boat for sale in post one.
Anyone can own a tupperware boat, it takes a unique person to own a wood boat. Make that 89 against and 11 go for it.

He bought it. We're now friends on Facebook. I'm glad he listened to US,not the "nay-sayers" that have nothing good to say about woodies.
I'm still thinking we should have our own Grand Banks Woodies forum.
What think you all ?

 

[mvweebles]

He bought it. We're now friends on Facebook. I'm glad he listened to US,not the "nay-sayers" that have nothing good to say about woodies.
I'm still thinking we should have our own Grand Banks Woodies forum.
What think you all ?

Please drop a note back in a year or so. For the record, my original naysayer post was heavily skewed towards a boat that had an expensive list of repairs, not because it was a woodie. That said, being a woodie has issues with resale, and meeting resistance from insurance, yard, and marina. Those are very real and reasonable concerns - would be really helpful if those concerns were addressed instead of just dismissing them as anti-wood pack animal.

I wish y'all well and a happy ownership experience.

Peter

 

[SteveK]

He bought it. We're now friends on Facebook. I'm glad he listened to US,not the "nay-sayers" that have nothing good to say about woodies.
I'm still thinking we should have our own Grand Banks Woodies forum.
What think you all ?

There are lemons in wood, tupperware and metal.
Each captain can make an informed decision on a boat purchase, there is no right or wrong. Not all nay-sayers were wrong in this thread. Any older boat must be viewed with experienced eyes.
I cannot imaging buying a $12K boat and then spending 100-200K fixing it up.
My limit is double the purchase price as long as that total brings it within range of the average values of same ready to go boats. That said, every boat I have owned, even a new one needed a wheelbarrow of money to make it mine.

 

[Nomad Willy]

One day I listened to a broker that had seen it all. Been there for decades.

He said the best boat buy is one that had changed owners fairly often and each new owner had invested hugely in boat systems like electronics, decor (rugs, varnish & stuff), mechanical, major structural and more. You’ve all seen it. Practically a new boat.

rsn48’s boat fits that fairly well.
There’s not many woodies out there now so if you see such a boat and lets say it just came off an extensive re-fit you found the gold mine.

But re a woodie you will need a really good surveyor that specializes in wood boats.

But it’s possible to buy a wood boat thats not a stupid move. But there’s a lot of if's connected.

When this forum started in 07 it was far easier to find a good wood boat. But not far from now the only good wood boats will be new wood boats. If I was flush enough to buy a new boat I’d be looking at a carefully orchestrated new wood boat. Not an exotic but a basic boat like they built in the 50’s. Not composite construction or a boat meant to turn heads but a boat not unlike an old simply planked boat or even a plywood boat.

 

[Art]

Ability for [hopefully] the correct choice of a boat to own is directly commensurate with a person's background with and experiences in boats/boating/marine-doings.

Points in fact:

Those of us... such as myself - if I may say so... with several decades of close-in boat, boating and marine experiences can usually [at first] self survey a boat and tell pretty well if it is a good deal to move forward on - or not. Increments thereafter leading toward purchase are usually quite a few and will tell the tale of buying or not.

Then there are those having no boat, boating or marine background/knowledge... many who request assistance for what to do regarding telling whether or not a boat is worthy of purchase... who come on TF with questions galore. For these persons I warn - be very careful and read each post very well. Then make your own nind up and go with what you feel is correct.

Good Luck to All Boat-People!

 

[727Gold]

All depends on one's priorities. We are into boating (1981 glass GB 32) because we like to go boating, first priority (The Only Way IS Underway). I have the responsibility for the second priority (retired 30 yr USN) of safety and reliability. My wife (the Queen of Brightwork) covers the third priority of impressive looks (hers and the boat!). With your proposed project, if your priorities include any active boating, this isn't your boat. If you gain enjoyment, a LOT of enjoyment, out of working on solving problems (hull, mechanical, electrical) with the boat tied up or on the hard, then maybe this is your boat. All boats are potential money losers, some more than others, this one for sure!

 

[Bryant]

GB 32 Woodie

There is only one way (IMO) that buying this boat makes any sense at all. That is to buy it for 12k, don't put another penny into it, use it till it quits and then donate it as a tax write off to one of the many charities that take even derelict boats, assuming you can get liability ins on it, which I assume you could. That would be a cheap way to own a GB 32 Woodie and get some enjoyment out of it. Otherwise, if you buy this boat, you will likely have $100k in it before it's all over, which is also fine if you have very deep pockets, want to own a classic wooden boat and can afford the cost, effort and time in annual maintenance to maintain it's value.

 

[whjkelly]

GB 32 Woodie

I went through the same decision 2 years back on several nice condition ( on the surface ) GB Woodies. Ended up buying an Island Gypsy 42 1995 for a really good price and don't have all the worry about wood hulls.

I agree with the Walk Away Group unless you prefer restoring things over boating.

The advice on a slightly more expensive but fibre glass hull is good. It will actually be cheaper even in the short run.

This charter boat probably made some good money for the owner but sounds like very little was put back into keeping it up to date.

I would not even offer to take this GB for free.

Sorry for the negative response but please listen to us.

 

[NUTIN FANCY TOO]

There are lemons in wood, tupperware and metal.
Each captain can make an informed decision on a boat purchase, there is no right or wrong. Not all nay-sayers were wrong in this thread. Any older boat must be viewed with experienced eyes.
I cannot imaging buying a $12K boat and then spending 100-200K fixing it up.
My limit is double the purchase price as long as that total brings it within range of the average values of same ready to go boats. That said, every boat I have owned, even a new one needed a wheelbarrow of money to make it mine.

To your point"spending $100,000 -$200,000 fixing it up"....the o.p. didn't say that. Anither nay-sayer did.
Ya'll have gotten beyond ridiculous with your imaginary repairs and your inflated estimates. This man may not be the "here,take my credit card,fix it,and call me when it's ready" type,certainty not the armchair admirals that most are. Some of us,meaning myself included, really enjoy working on our woodies. I can take mine out anytime I want,and,work on it anytime I want. A boat doesn't have to be on the hill to work on it. Hell,I'll bet most of the Armchair Admirals "on here don't even service their own boats. They would rather pay someone $700-$1000 to do it rather than get their hands dirty. They probably don't even pump their own fuel.
So,if anyone fits into that category, keep your opinions to yourself. You have no clue what we are doing with our woodies.
As always, this is only "my humble opinion ".

 

[Ski in NC]

30 yrs ago in my 20's, I did something similar. I bought an old (30yr old) 33' twin diesel fish boat. It was rough, but runable. I got it for a low price. I ran the crap out of it for four years.

I did basic maintenance and necessary repairs, but I did NOT try to restore it or even improve it much. Replaced a couple of bottom planks (taught myself how to do it). Did bottom paint, some topside paint, deck paint, hull paint, engine maintenance, etc. Some normal decay continued as expected, but not rapidly. I did not try to stop it.

I never insured it, back then (1990's) that was no big deal to docks. One dock was commercial, they did not care about anything. One was a muni dock, they never asked, then a mooring, then on a private dock that I purchased.

At the end of my ownership, I sold it. Sold for about $4k less than I bought it for. I saw it chugging around in my local area for the next 15yrs. Looked even more rough, but was still float'n and chug'n.

So that is one way to handle buying an old woody. Restoring one would be silly, unless you have deep pockets and deep passion.

 

[whjkelly]

To your point"spending $100,000 -$200,000 fixing it up"....the o.p. didn't say that. Anither nay-sayer did.
Ya'll have gotten beyond ridiculous with your imaginary repairs and your inflated estimates. This man may not be the "here,take my credit card,fix it,and call me when it's ready" type,certainty not the armchair admirals that most are. Some of us,meaning myself included, really enjoy working on our woodies. I can take mine out anytime I want,and,work on it anytime I want. A boat doesn't have to be on the hill to work on it. Hell,I'll bet most of the Armchair Admirals "on here don't even service their own boats. They would rather pay someone $700-$1000 to do it rather than get their hands dirty. They probably don't even pump their own fuel.
So,if anyone fits into that category, keep your opinions to yourself. You have no clue what we are doing with our woodies.
As always, this is only "my humble opinion ".

We all log in here on TF for peoples stories, opinions and advice. After that we hopefully have a lot of information to consider.

If you don't want peoples opinions then you should not ask for them. This fellow did and got some really good advice from the TF Group.

No need to go after us for letting him know what our thoughts are.

 

[Robster_in_edmonds]

I would say walk away for the following reasons: Number One is that boats used in charter have typically been over-worked and lots of minor damages have been covered over. When I was boat-hunting every charter boat looked great until I looked carefully. Lots of little things broken, woodwork damaged, and so on.

Number Two: I have a friend with a 50-foot woodie GB from the 1980s. Boathouse-kept until he bought it. Everything in good working order when he bought it. Every year he puts hundreds of hours into wood rot repair, varnishing, and lots of minor mechanical repairs. He loves, loves, loves the boat but the work is wearing him out (he's in his late sixties). In five years he won't be able to keep up with it.

Number Three: Only an idiot would take an old 32-foot boat from SF to the PNW. I have friends that darn near broke a 50-foot boat making that run and two of them were former Navy and knew what they were doing. That boat has been punished.

Number Four: If you have plenty of money then buy a nice boat and use it. If you don't have plenty of money then this boat will break you. In my experience a 32-foot boat is a starting point. If you love boating you'll end up going bigger very soon. We have a28-foot boat that we loved, used it for three years, then moved to a 50-footer.

Good luck with your decision.

Rob

 

[Xlantic]

He bought it. We're now friends on Facebook. I'm glad he listened to US,not the "nay-sayers" that have nothing good to say about woodies.
I'm still thinking we should have our own Grand Banks Woodies forum.
What think you all ?

Count me in.

 

[Xlantic]

I have had a fibreglass Grand Banks (1979 GB 42 Classic) and a wooden Grand Banks (1973 GB 50).

I have had more rot in the wooden one but essentially all of it has been in the house, not the hull.

And rot in a wood is actually quite easy to fix ...