Fuel Shock

[Socal_Cecil]

Ya, It's not biodiesel. I wouldn't use biodiesel because the sources are sketchy and it has gelling and organism issues. Biodiesel is converted using a transesterification process. This is a hydrogenation process.

It's a diesel fuel made from chemically converting renewable oils to diesel. Biodiesel takes natural oils and makes it "usable" in diesels but not actual diesel fuel. This stuff has full ASTM D975 diesel specs and is used all over the world with good results.

First marine related article for it I"ve found. The modern marine engine folks seem to like it.
https://waterways.org.uk/about-us/news/fuel-for-thought-hvo-greener-boating

I'm still reading up but may try adding 5 gal to the tank and seeing what happens.

 

[OldDan1943]

Until such time that any diesel substitute is significantly less expensively than the real stuff, I will stick with real diesel.

 

[lwarden]

We’re all paying the price for stopping the short, bald Hitler named Putin. (Nothing wrong with being short or bald.). Glory to the patriots in Ukraine and throughout the world who are supporting Ukraine, and oh by the way, Freedom, Democracy, and Freedom of the Seas. This time will pass, but this moment in history will live forever in the struggle for the right of free men and women to have a government that exists according to the consent of the people. Let’s slow down, use fuel of all kinds with discretion, and work for freedom, democracy and peace.

Well said. Sometimes you just need to wait things out and adapt as best as possible. Slow down, take less trips and once we start using less the price will come down. I was reading today that the profit from refining diesel has gone from around $8 a barrel to nearly $50. So much of it is a big money grab by the refineries. Unfortunately with limited refinery capacity there isn't much we can do about it but buy less.

 

[Mobcat]

$10 a Gallon in Australia atm and tipped to get to $15 a gallon in the coming quarter when the exice goes back to normal, if you didn’t have a trawler in Oz atm it would be hurting big time, as a 5k fill for me the other day hurt !!!! Bloody Russians !!!

 

[Bryant]

Fuel

Took on 213.9 gallons of diesel fuel today in San Diego @ $6.14 a gallon.

18 months ago it was $2.75. Wonder what happened? Oh yeah, Putin.

 

[All-at-sea]

You wanna try Europe!

€2.00 a litre in Spain, thats $2.10!

 

[JohnP]

18 months ago it was $2.75. Wonder what happened? Oh yeah, Putin.

Yeah. Must Be.

 

[Simi 60]

Increased fuel price hasn't been a shock
It has been an annoyance.
We knew it was coming, always was.
Like rising wages (when retired)
Like higher insurance costs (bastards)
The cost of doing business I tells myself.
Glad we're not leveraged to to the eyeballs.

 

[Larry M]

Nassau Bahamas on Thursday $6.67/ US gallon. West End yesterday $6.27gallon.

 

[Old Sea Dog]

BTW..... gas uses octane rating
Diesel uses cetane rating

 

[chivyw]

Diesel prices

We left Maryland in Oct 2021. Did the ICW. Spent the winter in Florida. Diesel price went up over $2.00/gal by April 2022 for the return trip. By the way, you guys in California voted for the person in charge of blaming everyone and everything for high costs of fuel. Sorry I digress.

 

[Derik]

politicians

Fuel prices had nearly doubled prior to Russia attacking Ukraine. So I blame it on the tall bald man more than the short bald man, nothing wrong with being bald and tall of course.

Here in California it's a trifecta blame tall bald man, short bald man and younger handsome man who lives in Sacramento.

 

[OldDan1943]

When everything has returned to near normal, does anyone believe fuel and gas will return to hear normal? HAHA

 

[IRENE]

Within a few cents of $6.00/gal at Sequim and Anacortes, yesterday.

 

[hollywood8118]

Fuel prices had nearly doubled prior to Russia attacking Ukraine. So I blame it on the tall bald man more than the short bald man, nothing wrong with being bald and tall of course.

Here in California it's a trifecta blame tall bald man, short bald man and younger handsome man who lives in Sacramento.

You think that greasy haired guy in Sac. is handsome?, I thought only he and his minion of sandal wearing prius drivers thought he was "pretty".
He is ruining Cali.
HW

 

[O C Diver]

When everything has returned to near normal, does anyone believe fuel and gas will return to hear normal? HAHA

Retail fuel prices are a function of supply and demand.

This picture was taken when I fueled on November 13th 2020. It was 3 times that price less than a decade before.



Ted

 

[Hippocampus]

Reality is no elected politician has any meaningful effect on the cost of oil. Problem is world wide. Impact of US politicians is trivial. Opening national reserves has had no meaningful effect. Tax holidays similar. This commodity is mainly controlled by autocrats, dictatorships and royalty. (Russia, Mid East, Venezuela etc.). Putin has gamed this very effectively. Sells less for more money so only slight decrease in total revenues. Given multinationals (refineries, oil companies, wholesalers, brokers etc) are amoral as well all involved players are gaming this to great effect.
That said totally believe this is a sacrifice we must make. Any person who doesn’t honor in any country (including our own) that the people should have free and inclusive open elections whose results should not be attempted to be overthrown by violence, misinformation, or insurrection should be condemned and opposed.
There are honorable people like Cheney and others who put their country before their self interest. But here think you have Putin fantasy he’s Peter the great combined with greed leading to a perfect storm.

 

[Socal_Cecil]

To be fair, the only reason it was cheap was because the entire economy was shutdown. US oil production tanked in 2019. I remember barrels of oil being at negative prices which means they were literally paying people to take it away. That discourages big oil from reinvesting capital.

And anyone who hasn't gone electric, my leaf gets 220 miles for $10 in electricity( vs $50 if gas) and Tesla's can add 200 miles in 15min. Electrics are faster, more reliable, require less maintenance, have up to 300 and 400 mile ranges and let you fuel at home. The batteries have 8 to 10 year warranties too. The technology is mature today, we no longer have to wait.

You definitely can't road trip in some areas( Arizona for one) but what I save in fuel will let me rent if I want to go to Havasu on to of more than paying for the cars price difference. Its also still worth more than I paid a year ago due to rebates and incentives.

In general if I drive 55 I get 30% more ranges than if I drive 85( which would be true of gas cars and even more extreme for boats). I've had to slow down a few times to keep from stopping on the way home( mainly because I hate gas stations where a lot of chargers are located in California).

I work in the pharma industry (radionuclide tracers), not fuel supplies or electric vehicles in case It sounds like I'm selling anything.

 

[O C Diver]

To be fair, the only reason it was cheap was because the entire economy was shutdown. US oil production tanked in 2019. I remember barrels of oil being at negative prices which means they were literally paying people to take it away. That discourages big oil from reinvesting capital.

Ok, and how is that not supply and demand?

Gas and diesel can be profitable at less than half of their current price. Still supply and demand.

Ted

 

[OldDan1943]

Personally, I enjoy my Lincoln hybrid. If I can control my right foot, I get close to 40 mpg on the highway. I have a 300 mile bladder and a 400 mile car.

 

[O C Diver]

And anyone who hasn't gone electric, my leaf gets 220 miles for $10 in electricity( vs $50 if gas) and Tesla's can add 200 miles in 15min. Electrics are faster, more reliable, require less maintenance, have up to 300 and 400 mile ranges and let you fuel at home. The batteries have 8 to 10 year warranties too. The technology is mature today, we no longer have to wait.

You definitely can't road trip in some areas( Arizona for one) but what I save in fuel will let me rent if I want to go to Havasu on to of more than paying for the cars price difference. Its also still worth more than I paid a year ago due to rebates and incentives.

In general if I drive 55 I get 30% more ranges than if I drive 85( which would be true of gas cars and even more extreme for boats). I've had to slow down a few times to keep from stopping on the way home( mainly because I hate gas stations where a lot of chargers are located in California).

I work in the pharma industry (radionuclide tracers), not fuel supplies or electric vehicles in case It sounds like I'm selling anything.

That's all well and good until enough people switch to electric. Then the state realizes the lost revenue on fuel sales tax. Then your vehicle registration fee goes to 4 figures. Whether you drive gas or electric, the roads need to be fixed.

Ted

 

[Socal_Cecil]

Ok, and how is that not supply and demand?

Gas and diesel can be profitable at less than half of their current price. Still supply and demand.

Ted

It is supply and demand. I don't believe it stated it wasn't. I thought it was valuable to point to the start and cause of the supply reduction so people can't hijack the current lack of supply to attack recent policy changes. Even in spite of the lack of supply big oil had come right out and said they will continue to prioritize dividends to share holders vs increased investment in production. As much as that sucks I have to admit it caused me to buy oil stocks.

 

[OldDan1943]

Lets's see, toilet paper shortage, baby formula shortage, gas and fuel shortage and now I read, tampon shortages. Oh the carnage, when will it stop?

 

[Socal_Cecil]

That's all well and good until enough people switch to electric. Then the state realizes the lost revenue on fuel sales tax. Then your vehicle registration fee goes to 4 figures. Whether you drive gas or electric, the roads need to be fixed.

Ted

Current federal fuel tax is 20c a gallon and 25c a gallon average for state. Assuming 30mpg it's about 1.5c per mile tax. At 10000 miles a year it's $150 total for the average driver in road taxes a year. It would probably be more efficient to apply the taxes to insurance which is already based on mileage and would know the rated fuel economy for the vehicle insured. Instead of basing it on fuel economy we could change it to weight which is probably more appropriate or some combination of the two. Commercial trucks already log all that so could be taxed by the weight and miles of each load and added to the customers bill.

I like math, sometimes it confirms my preconceptions, sometimes I learn something. I really didn't know what I payed yearly until you brought it up though.

 

[Hippocampus]

It won’t until market forces play out. First president (fdr) who tried to truly manipulate markets did three things.
Change tax code to change people and businesses behaviors. Prior sole purpose of taxes was to raise revenue.
Use government as instrument of employment.
Regulate markets to protect people from themselves.
It was genius and brought us out of the Great Depression. But just like globalization there’s a downside. You are feeling it now and will for a while. We’re a long way from Adam Smith.
Corporations and multinationals are treated as individuals. They are not. Be it Abbot, the petro giants, tech or Gasprom.

 

[jimfrens]

I paid $6.53 for diesel last week in Rhode Island… or maybe it was Connecticut, not sure.

 

[Alaskan Sea-Duction]

It’s interesting to me that fuel bought in Alaska isn’t dyed, and I suspect that’s because it’s not taxed any differently than road fuel. Perhaps some of our former and present AK residents can shed light on this?

I believe it is a State issue. When we asked the attendant in Sitka, he stated Alaska chooses to NOT put red dye in the fuel. However fuel is taxed.

FYI Canada doesn't do the dye either.

 

[O C Diver]

Current federal fuel tax is 20c a gallon and 25c a gallon average for state. Assuming 30mpg it's about 1.5c per mile tax. At 10000 miles a year it's $150 total for the average driver in road taxes a year. It would probably be more efficient to apply the taxes to insurance which is already based on mileage and would know the rated fuel economy for the vehicle insured. Instead of basing it on fuel economy we could change it to weight which is probably more appropriate or some combination of the two. Commercial trucks already log all that so could be taxed by the weight and miles of each load and added to the customers bill.

I like math, sometimes it confirms my preconceptions, sometimes I learn something. I really didn't know what I payed yearly until you brought it up though.

Do they base your vehicle registration in California on how many miles you drive per year? I can see vehicle registrations based on the type of vehicle, but I doubt they're going to invest the effort to differentiate between your car and someone driving 50,000 miles per year when it comes to road use tax. They haven't so far.

Ted

 

[rslifkin]

Do they base your vehicle registration in California on how many miles you drive per year? I can see vehicle registrations based on the type of vehicle, but I doubt they're going to invest the effort to differentiate between your car and someone driving 50,000 miles per year when it comes to road use tax. They haven't so far.

Ted

Making it mileage based would only make sense in states with inspections, I think. They already record mileage at inspection time, so using that for road tax would be easy. Of course, they don't know how many of those miles were out of state, so...

Realistically, I'd expect to see more highway tolls to gain revenue based on usage.

 

[DNT99611]

To be fair, the only reason it was cheap was because the entire economy was shutdown. US oil production tanked in 2019. I remember barrels of oil being at negative prices which means they were literally paying people to take it away. That discourages big oil from reinvesting capital.

And anyone who hasn't gone electric, my leaf gets 220 miles for $10 in electricity( vs $50 if gas) and Tesla's can add 200 miles in 15min. Electrics are faster, more reliable, require less maintenance, have up to 300 and 400 mile ranges and let you fuel at home. The batteries have 8 to 10 year warranties too. The technology is mature today, we no longer have to wait.

You definitely can't road trip in some areas( Arizona for one) but what I save in fuel will let me rent if I want to go to Havasu on to of more than paying for the cars price difference. Its also still worth more than I paid a year ago due to rebates and incentives.

In general if I drive 55 I get 30% more ranges than if I drive 85( which would be true of gas cars and even more extreme for boats). I've had to slow down a few times to keep from stopping on the way home( mainly because I hate gas stations where a lot of chargers are located in California).

I work in the pharma industry (radionuclide tracers), not fuel supplies or electric vehicles in case It sounds like I'm selling anything.

It would be a big help if folks would post their kwh cost when they speak about costs to run their EV's. I am pretty sure my cost is several times the average.