De icer question

[paulga]

Hi,
I want to install a Kasco bubbler 2400D for the winter. The marina allows me to plug in from an available pedestal. I plan to use this pigtail adapter to connect the bubbler.

There are two questions. First, the plug end says L5-20P, I think the pedestal socket is L5-30P, is there any concern that this adapter working in a 30P socket?

Second, the bubbler requires a GFCI protected circuit. This pigtail adapter does not have GFCI protection. I plan to add a regular outdoor timer, like the GE extreme weather outdoor 24 hour timer, but the specs of such mechanical timers do not include GFCI. How to meet the GFCI requirement?

 

[Comodave]

Get a waterproof electrical box and mount a 20 amp GFI in it. Run a cable from the outlet on the adapter to the electrical box. Plug the bubbler into the electrical box.

 

[paulga]

Get a waterproof electrical box and mount a 20 amp GFI in it. Run a cable from the outlet on the adapter to the electrical box. Plug the bubbler into the electrical box.

There is assembled box for sale. This satisfies the GFCI requirement. But It will trip at 20amp, the pedestal circuit breaker trips at 30amp. The bubbler does not have a built in fuse, could it be already damaged at 20amp power surge before the GFCI activated?

 

[Iggy]

Get a waterproof electrical box and mount a 20 amp GFI in it. Run a cable from the outlet on the adapter to the electrical box. Plug the bubbler into the electrical box.

I would take it one more step. Add a 20A breaker to the new box. The power station uses a 30a breaker which is too high. Since the GFI is rated for 20A and should be using no smaller than12 gauge cords for 20A.

 

[paulga]

I would take it one more step. Add a 20A breaker to the new box. The power station uses a 30a breaker which is too high. Since the GFI is rated for 20A and should be using no smaller than12 gauge cords for 20A.

Is the purpose of the 20A breaker to protect the bubbler?
the breaker trips at 20A. without the breaker, the gfci outlet also trips at 20A. so I don't get it.
the bubbler's operating amp is 5.4A. so should a 10A or 15A breaker be used?

 

[Comodave]

I would take it one more step. Add a 20A breaker to the new box. The power station uses a 30a breaker which is too high. Since the GFI is rated for 20A and should be using no smaller than12 gauge cords for 20A.

I meant to specify that but I guess I didn’t.

 

[Comodave]

Is the purpose of the 20A breaker to protect the bubbler?
the breaker trips at 20A. without the breaker, the gfci outlet also trips at 20A. so I don't get it.
the bubbler's operating amp is 5.4A. so should a 10A or 15A breaker be used?

The purpose of the breaker is to protect the wiring.

 

[Iggy]

To protect he wiring and your boat from catching fire. Keep in mind, the 30A breaker in the tower has been exposed to moisture for god knows how long. Some are very hard to trip due to this.

The GFI outlet could trip if on over current. It may not, its not a designed as circuit breaker. They provide protection when the current in the HOT wire is not balanced. Why risk it? Is your boat worth the cost of a breaker?

 

[paulga]

To protect he wiring and your boat from catching fire. Keep in mind, the 30A breaker in the tower has been exposed to moisture for god knows how long. Some are very hard to trip due to this.

The GFI outlet could trip if on over current. It may not, its not a designed as circuit breaker. They provide protection when the current in the HOT wire is not balanced. Why risk it? Is your boat worth the cost of a breaker?

Got it. So it's very important. But 20a is too high for the bubbler. This circuit will power only the bubbler. Is a 10a breaker better?

 

[Iggy]

On start up, the amperage will be high. The next question would be, how high? The manufacturer could tell you, OR do a test your self.

 

[paulga]

On start up, the amperage will be high. The next question would be, how high? The manufacturer could tell you, OR do a test your self.

The manufacturer told me it requires a 15a GFCI outlet and a 20a circuit breaker.

I saw 3 types of 20a circuit breakers, standard trip, afci then GFCI, priced low to high. Is a standard trip good to use in an outdoor electrical box?

 

[Bmarler]

Locked rotor amps are listed as 20. That’s why you need the 20amp breaker. It eliminates nuisance tripping as opposed to a 15 amp circuit breaker.
Can’t believe it’s time for winter planning already.

 

[paulga]

Locked rotor amps are listed as 20. That’s why you need the 20amp breaker. It eliminates nuisance tripping as opposed to a 15 amp circuit breaker.
Can’t believe it’s time for winter planning already.

Does "locked rotor amp 20a" mean 20amp will cause the rotor to lock?

 

[Jeff F]

Joining in late here. Does the pedestal not have 15a GFCI outlets? And aren't the L5-20P and L5-30P different sizes?

I've used bubblers up to 1 HP on dedicated 15a GFCI circuits. Think the OPs is smaller than that. The 20a in front of a 15a requirement makes no sense to me.

 

[SteveK]

aren't the L5-20P and L5-30P different sizes?

I sure hope so.

 

[paulga]

Joining in late here. Does the pedestal not have 15a GFCI outlets? And aren't the L5-20P and L5-30P different sizes?

I've used bubblers up to 1 HP on dedicated 15a GFCI circuits. Think the OPs is smaller than that. The 20a in front of a 15a requirement makes no sense to me.

it looks like the "L5-20P" fits the 30P socket on the pedestal.

the manufacturer's said that the bubbler should be plugged to a 15a gfci outlet, if adding a main circuit breaker for this circuit, the breaker should be 20a.

so a 15a gfci outlet will not trip for a transient 20a current every time the bubbler is starting?

 

[Jeff F]

so a 15a gfci outlet will not trip for a transient 20a current every time the bubbler is starting?

The bubbler will start and run fine with a 15a GFCI outlet, as long as that outlet doesn't share a circuit with other high loads.

Again, does the marina have existing 15a plugs? That's your easiest starting point by far.

 

[luna]

The radius of the prongs on a L5-20P is much smaller than that of a L5-30P. Rest assured that a 20 won't fit into a 30. NEMA wouldn't have it any other way.
Here is a chart that may give you an idea of the differences.

https://www.internationalconfig.com/catalog_pages/flanged_inlets_flanged_outlets_guide.pdf

The everyday GFCI that is found in every modern kitchen or bathroom is not a Circuit Breaker designed to prevent an overload. The 15 A rating that is given to this GFCI is simply the rating of the connections that receive the wiring and the plug's prongs, just like the much more common 15 A Duplex Receptacle where you plug your iphone charger into the wall. It's not an overload Circuit Breaker either.

This GFCI simply compares the current on the ungrounded (Black) conductor to that on the grounded (White) conductor and if there is a difference of greater than about 5mA, in an effort to save your life, the GFCI opens the circuit. GFCI's react to an imbalance of current not excessive current.

Good luck with the bubbler.

 

[Comodave]

Look at this adapter. I found it on West Marine.

Marinco Shore Power Pigtail Adapter, 30 Amp 125V Male to 3-Way 15 Amp 125V Female with GCI