Challenge Refilling Coolant

[mgreen]

I have a TAMD 41 P with a hot water heater in my 1998 Camano Troll. I pulled all my coolers and heat exchangers for cleaning and inspection and replaced several hoses. I am now having a challenge refilling the coolant and am looking for ideas. I don't know exactly how much I need to put back in because I did not do a good job of keeping all the sea water separate from the coolant but so far only have 3 gallons in. If I had to guess, I feel that I need to get at least 7 gallons back in. I have tried burping the system by squeezing hoses but have not been able to get the level in the reservoir to drop down. I ran the engine for a minute but the pump must be air locked as it had no effect. It is a 2 hour trip back to the boat so I would like to have some ideas along with any tools that will be helpful.

I am considering cutting in a Tee and add another valve as near to the water heater as possible and using a vacuum pump to pull as much air and coolant I can to that place. Maybe even 2 tees, one on each hose.

Any other ideas or tricks I should be considering?

 

[Bmarler]

Seven gallons seems like quite a lot, but I don’t know what the heat exchanger holds. The hot water coil won’t hold much, but the hoses will if there’s any distance between the tank and engine.
I’d run the engine some more, keeping an eye on the temp gauge. Try to get it up to temp where the thermostat will open.
Keep checking the hoses and block for hot spots. Also check for cold spots where they should be.
You can even run with the cap off the expansion tank so you can monitor the coolant level while running. Use be ready to shut down quickly if the temps start climbing.

 

[ksanders]

Easiest would be to remove the end off of one or two of the highest hoses

That would let the air escape

 

[mgreen]

The water heater is above the engine. I don't know how much coolant the heater holds, but I am worried about having too much air in the system that I air lock the water pump. Am I over thinking this?

I assume that I will need to monitor the reservoir for a while and keep adding.

Because one of the thermostats has a small hole it it, I am not supposed to need to do anything to get coolant past them if I am patient.

 

[Bmarler]

I see, the water heater being above the engine is a complication. I wouldn’t be afraid to run the engine keeping a watchful eye on the temp gauges and feeling the hoses. An IR temp gun is even better. you can see if cold raw water is coming in and heating up before exiting, as well as checking to see the temp drop across the heat exchanger and temp rise as it passes through the engine.

 

[RT Firefly]

Greetings,
Mr. mg. How about temporarily taking the HWT out of the loop. Meaning connect the HWT coolant input directly to the HWT coolant output thereby allowing you to properly fill the engine and HE's etc. When satisfied that you have the correct level in the expansion tank connect in the HWT and add coolant as needed. Shouldn't be more than 1/2 qt. or so, I'm guessing.

 

[nussbda]

When I periodically replace the coolant in my TAMD-41pa (2002 Camano Troll) it takes approximately 10 quarts. As recommended above, just check occasionally as the engine warms up and if necessary add additional coolant as any air pockets work themselves out.

Dave

 

[Mac G]

Run the engine at idle at dock with the fill cap on top of engine off so air can escape.
Slowly add coolant as needed until topped off.
Then replace that cap and make sure expansion tank is at proper level.
Anecdotally have heard of farmers who changed coolant in their tractors getting air-lock when refilling so solution is to just start running, with radiator cap off, and let all the air escape as the engine bounces around doing its thing.
Air should rise and find its way out, eventually.

 

[Mac G]

and when first filling new coolant after changing, when engine is cold and off, need to add very s l o w l y - do not pour in quckly all at once. Need to add slowly so air can escape as fluid enters. Too much fluid too quickly will overwhelm and trap inside.

 

[Mac G]

Run the engine at idle at dock with the fill cap on top of engine off so air can escape.
Slowly add coolant as needed until topped off.
Then replace that cap and make sure expansion tank is at proper level.
Anecdotally have heard of farmers who changed coolant in their tractors getting air-lock when refilling so solution is to just start running, with radiator cap off, and let all the air escape as the engine bounces around doing its thing.
Air should rise and find its way out, eventually.

And if you start overheating at idle shut down immediately.
You may have to drain your fresh coolant out into clean containers and start all over from scratch if you are deeply and ineffably air-locked.
Just be sure to add very very slowly and let air burp out as you you slowly add back in.

 

[Mac G]

Here is the contraption I devised for adding coolant slowly.
Got the container at Tractor Supply.
Added gate value, fittings and hose.
Place above engine level.
Open valve slightly to slowly add coolant.
Let gravity do the work.
No messing around with funnels.
No accidently spilling on engine and into bilge.
Adjust flow with gate valve.
Very easy.
Can be used for other things too.

 

[luna]

If this continues to be a problem and you have those annoying dribble the coolant on the floor Petcock valves commonly used on engines, next time the coolant is drained, remove one or more of the OEM petcock(s) from the lowest level on the engine and install these in there place. Confirm thread size and type first of course, but most are 1/4" NPT. Your TAMD could be different.
Although these are brass, they are designed to be installed on diesel engines. The fact that they are stubby, helps them survive.

https://s1partscenter.com/brands/international/engine/cylinder-head/plug/2506271c1

Now you have the ability to control the coolant by way of a hose when you drain, and also the ability to pump new coolant in, from the bottom of the engine. This method would normally chase the air out naturally.

Once the engine itself is full, stop the pump and put the heat exchanger "Rad Cap" back on, have the Admiral at the domestic water heater with the coolant supply and return hoses off of the water heater and stuffed into 2 empty milk jugs. Start the pump, stop it when she sees coolant. Reassemble everything, check levels, start engine, check levels, you should be done. No mess, no fuss.

My engines contain about 20 gallons of coolant each. I change coolant about every 3 years. I pump to drain and fill, with the containers on the dock in the wheelbarrow. It saves my aching back.

Good luck.

 

[Portage_Bay]

Lots of engine rooms lack overhead clearnace to make it easy to re-fill coolant. I use a Harbor Freight battery powered transfer pump. The flow rate is easly controlled by turning the switch on and off to meet the suggestion to fill slowly.

 

[rslifkin]

Some engines are a pain to bleed the air out of, others happen pretty easily. Unless it's an engine known for being hard to bleed or with a specific process to bleed it, I just get it as full as I can before startup (removing a hose at a high point if there's an obvious air bubble to eliminate).

Start it with the cap off, keep topping off the coolant until the level stops dropping. Then cap the system, let it warm up fully so the thermostat opens, and shut it down and let it cool. Refill the overflow tank after it cools (it will most likely suck some in) and most of the air should be gone. Any small amounts left should purge on their own over the next heat cycle or 2.

If there's no way for air to bleed past the thermostat until it opens it may be harder to get all of the air out and you may have to let it warm up fully with the cap open (as it may burp a lot of air out when the thermostat opens). Most engines have some form of small thermostat bypass to let air out or a bleed valve in the thermostat itself to let air past.

 

[RickyD]

I have a TAMD 41 P with a hot water heater in my 1998 Camano Troll. I pulled all my coolers and heat exchangers for cleaning and inspection and replaced several hoses. I am now having a challenge refilling the coolant and am looking for ideas. I don't know exactly how much I need to put back in because I did not do a good job of keeping all the sea water separate from the coolant but so far only have 3 gallons in. If I had to guess, I feel that I need to get at least 7 gallons back in. I have tried burping the system by squeezing hoses but have not been able to get the level in the reservoir to drop down. I ran the engine for a minute but the pump must be air locked as it had no effect. It is a 2 hour trip back to the boat so I would like to have some ideas along with any tools that will be helpful.

I am considering cutting in a Tee and add another valve as near to the water heater as possible and using a vacuum pump to pull as much air and coolant I can to that place. Maybe even 2 tees, one on each hose.

Any other ideas or tricks I should be considering?

My Cat 3208's hold about 5 gallons as I recall. It does take awhile to heat the engines so run some more I guess. Add via the expansion tanks and watch the temp gauge.

 

[Comodave]

Lots of engine rooms lack overhead clearnace to make it easy to re-fill coolant. I use a Harbor Freight battery powered transfer pump. The flow rate is easly controlled by turning the switch on and off to meet the suggestion to fill slowly.

That is exactly what I use. Mine take about 7 gallons per engine and access above the filler is very tight. With the pump it is simple to fill and doesn’t go really fast so I had no trouble with air in the system.

 

[DougR]

Your TAMD41 cooling system has a 20 liter capacity, 5.28 Gal., without a hot water heater circuit. As many have mentioned, idle the engine with the cap off of the expansion tank and the system will bleed itself. Sometimes loosening the banjo bolt at the top of the turbo bleed line helps get the air out of the turbo. Snug it back up when solid water flows.


The normal heater hose for the 41 engine is 5/8” diameter . Ten feet of 5/8” hose holds about .159 gallon, so 20 feet ( over and back) equals about one third gallon. The hot water heater should eventually bleed itself, but it would be preferable to have a vent by the tank, or have the expansion tank mounted higher than the heater.

 

[smith6]

looks like you have a lot of suggetions already. i have the same engine and it takes about 4 gallons. fill it up then run it with cap on or off. under load if you can. Where is the boat located?

 

[capefearcruiser]

Did the same with my '96 Camano tamd41 a few years ago. Just filled it with coolant, ran it until it warmed up. let it cool off and topped it off. I think it took about 3 1/2 gallons.

 

[mgreen]

Thanks all for the great suggestions. It turns out that most of the problem was me and my memory of the what P.O. told me about the capacity and just plain over thinking.

I got up to the boat this week to complete this project.

I turned the valves off to the water heater and pulled one of the hoses off to siphon some of the coolant out. I very carefully siphoned a bit out, and kept topping it off. The end result is that pulled out about 1 gallon and topped off a gallon.

I started the engine up and the coolant did not drop any. I am pretty sure that I have a pretty full system. I did not get up to full temp, so will watch carefully when I do get out next time.

Something important I did learn is that I could see coolant running into the reservoir from the small hose that is the return from the turbo so I know that I am pumping coolant and not airlocked. I also learned that the Volvo dual thermostat that has a small bypass hole in one side did its job. I was in good shape prior to my worried exercise in overthinking.

I would like to thank everyone who responded as as there was value in each response. Every response had a nugget of information that was helpful.

 

[mgreen]

looks like you have a lot of suggetions already. i have the same engine and it takes about 4 gallons. fill it up then run it with cap on or off. under load if you can. Where is the boat located?

I am moored at Skyline in Flounder Bay. I plan on keeping an eye out for anyone on this forum this next year. If you see me, drop on by!

 

[Greg QS]

It is common after re filling you will seem to loose coolant. Don't be alarmed just keep your overflow bottle toped off to the correct level when cool. It will take a few heat cycles to remove all the air from any engine.

 

[Marco Flamingo]

Here is the contraption I devised for adding coolant slowly.
Got the container at Tractor Supply.
Added gate value, fittings and hose.
Place above engine level.
Open valve slightly to slowly add coolant.
Let gravity do the work.
No messing around with funnels.
No accidently spilling on engine and into bilge.
Adjust flow with gate valve.
Very easy.
Can be used for other things too.

Just the system I need for my FLA batteries. Fill with distilled water. Put the water jug temporarily higher than the batteries. Use a push button valve instead of a gate valve. Squirt, squirt, squirt and stow the jug.

I bought one of the automatic battery fill pitchers, but haven't been happy with it. I have to shake it to get it to get a glug, and then lift it out to see if the cell is full. Put it back in again, etc. It takes >15 minutes as a contortionist to fill the cells. With a push button valve, I can put the hose in, have a flashlight in the other hand, and squirt in the right amount. I see another DIY project in my future.

 

[Comodave]

I have an automatic filler jug and find that it works very well. With it there isn’t a need to be able to see into the cells, just wait until the glugging sound stops and they are full.