Boating Courses

[Eddie]

I am new to boating recently purchasing our first boat, at Silverton 43. My wife and I signed up for the Seamanship course offered by the USPS and started it a few weeks ago. We like it so far, especially being able to ask questions and hear stories.

We are told the next course would be Piloting. Here is the course description.

Piloting is the first and most basic navigation course, covering chart reading, course plotting, and basic coastal or inland navigation, including basic GPS usage. This course goes into more detail than the charting information covered in the public courses.

One problem is that we would like to take the course in Greensboro NC near our home but it may not be offered unless there are 4-5 students. It is offered in starting October 10.

My questions are, 1) Is this course recommended and 2) Any ideas how to help find 3-4 more people so they have the course?

 

[Bigsfish]

Congrats of you decision.

Yes piloting and advanced piloting are recommended even when using GPS.

Best was to spread the news is word of mouth. You can print some flyers and go to the public ramps and pass them out or put under wiper arms on vehicles with trailers. Most local radio stations will give air time to promote public service advice. Have any friends?

 

[psneeld]

Be careful about stories and things heard not in print.

Good luck with the instruction, hope it helps.

I am not familiar with power squadron instruction personally, but have heard less horror stories than from USCGAUX instruction.

While both organizations do an unbelievable amount of good.....

Look at the actual qualifications of the instructor. Boating for 50 years or so doesn't make you an expert instructor or subject matter expert...

While you may learn quite a bit, verify what isn't written into the course as I have seen way too much bad info passed along through these courses....even private ones for that matter.

While not the same, a huge amount can be learned from even the free on line courses and then asking around with other boaters or on line for specific questions. The pay courses on line probably allow back and forth contact.

Again, good luck.

 

[Bigsfish]

Actually the instructor follows the book and the exams are already developed. Instructors main purpose is to help students over parts they don't understand, it's pretty easy.

 

[bayview]

After decades of boating and studying boating I took the USPS courses through AP and found them reasonably well done and fortunately had good instructors. The weather course was also good.
However you will also need real on the water instruction to drive that boat so I would find a good local teaching captain and spend some time getting comfortable with basic maneuvering and boat systems.

 

[ranger58sb]

We are told the next course would be Piloting.

My questions are, 1) Is this course recommended

Yes.

-Chris

 

[dhays]

Eddie, taking the piloting course would be a great idea. Actually, taking most any course would be a good idea.

I've never had a formal course in boating. Everything I've learned has been from my parents as a kid and what I've picked up over the last 54 years of boating. I know LOTS of stuff! Even so, I think I would benefit a lot from any of the USPS courses.

 

[alormaria]

The quality of the instructor makes the course more enjoyable. The book, the study guides and the lesson plans make the course. Take a look at the materials and ask around to find a personable and knowledgeable instructor. Traditional piloting is a great subject no matter which organization teaches it. It gives you the background of what the electronics are doing for you.

Computers should work, people should think.

 

[psneeld]

Actually the instructor follows the book and the exams are already developed. Instructors main purpose is to help students over parts they don't understand, it's pretty easy.

Thats the way it should work, but we all know that instructors can embellish beyond the course.

When they are well experienced and smart enough to note the diffetence between established standards and oersonal exoerience...then all is well.

As a newbie, I just caution everyone to make dang sure the instructor's certification and resume is more than a title, uniform, organizational position, etc.

 

[boomerang]

Be careful about stories and things heard not in print.

Good luck with the instruction, hope it helps.

I am not familiar with power squadron instruction personally, but have heard less horror stories than from USCGAUX instruction.

While both organizations do an unbelievable amount of good.....

Look at the actual qualifications of the instructor. Boating for 50 years or so doesn't make you an expert instructor or subject matter expert...

While you may learn quite a bit, verify what isn't written into the course as I have seen way too much bad info passed along through these courses....even private ones for that matter.

While not the same, a huge amount can be learned from even the free on line courses and then asking around with other boaters or on line for specific questions. The pay courses on line probably allow back and forth contact.

Again, good luck.

Why the negativity towards the power squadron/USCG aux? I'm a member of neither but these guys are out there willing to share their wisdom & yes, 50 years of experience boating does tend to make you qualified! One doesn't have to take everything they pass along in a boating class as the only way to do things, but as in the case of someone with minimal experience such as the OP, it's a good point in the right direction.

 

[psneeld]

Having been in charge of many USCGAUX flotillas when a senior USCG officer and having taught boating safety courses for 15 years with students that dropped out of USCGAUX courses due to loss of confidence...and so many other inputs I could list....

Just like advice here on TF, if you dont absolutely trust the advice, double check it.

How many old timers at marinas have opinios that are so far off base it is near criminal? Remember, some of them may wear uniforms and teach.

Me included, but most who hire me have checked my credentials.

Plus, if you think 50 years of boating means crap, teach captains licensing like I did and realize how little they really know that makes them qualified to be an instructor.

This week I have been screening captains to be an assistance towing captain....even licensed captains can know so little.

You dont have to be an unlimited master to run a boat, but as an instructor, you have to know what is right and wrong, speculation doesnt count as too many USCGAUX captain wannabes have done in my experience.

As I said, wonderful organizations overall, just make sure the instructor YOU have, has the credentials to back his off syllabus comments.

Plus it is the newbies that are most vulnerable to bad advice...think about that.

 

[alormaria]

"Why the negativity towards the power squadron/USCG aux? I'm a member of neither but these guys are out there willing to share their wisdom & yes, 50 years of experience boating does tend to make you qualified!"

No. They are qualified instructors because they have studied the training material, passed the instructor exam, practice taught in front of a qualified instructor or examiner and now have enough hours and experience to stand in front of a class and teach what is in the book.

 

[psneeld]

Thus is my rub when some long time but relatively inexperienced boaters try to teach outside the course material.

Some instructors certainly are more than qualified...but the newbie has to make sure of the source and not just believe any instructor because they are up front.

 

[Bigsfish]

Instructors need to stay in their lane!

 

[Eddie]

Thanks to everyone for your input.

Here are my takeaways...

1. Take the Piloting course and others offered.
2. Ask my friends to sign up so the class will have enough students.
3. Read the material, listen to the instructor and form my own decisions based on my experience and good judgement.

I do have a question for Psneeld. You mentored free online courses. Can you point me in the direction to find those? Also, looks like you are retired USCG. Our daughter and son-in-law are both in the CG and relocated from Norfolk to San Diego this week. Thank you for your service.

Again, thanks to all of you for your comments!

 

[markpierce]

Read relevant texts. If taken to heart, that will get you ninety-percent there. The other part is knowing how to handle your boat in tight situations. Docking: do it slowly. A 43-foot boat is a large "jump" for a first boat.

 

[koliver]

2) f you can't find enough students, pay the tuition for the empty seats. Then you get more of a private lesson.

 

[Bay Pelican]

2) f you can't find enough students, pay the tuition for the empty seats. Then you get more of a private lesson.

Keith

I don't think either the US or Canadian Power Squadron charges tuition for taking a course. The minimum number of students requirement is just to justify the large amount of time devoted by the volunteers who teach the course.

Piloting is a fairly popular course so an active squadron should not have much trouble filling the seats.

 

[Eddie]

Keith



I don't think either the US or Canadian Power Squadron charges tuition for taking a course. The minimum number of students requirement is just to justify the large amount of time devoted by the volunteers who teach the course.



Piloting is a fairly popular course so an active squadron should not have much trouble filling the seats.

Actually the courses seem to be $70 for non members and $50 for members, at least in my area. Which in my opinion is very reasonable for an 8-10 week course and materials.

I imagine if we were closer to the coast there would be less of a problem getting enough students to have the courses.

Here is a link to the electrical course in Greensboro NC - https://www.usps.org/cgi-bin-nat/eddept/800/getregformx.cgi?L-14577

 

[psneeld]

When I taught certification courses, it wasn't uncommon for people to pay for a full class minimum if they wanted the class at their convenience....time, location, schedule, etc.

Then again, much of my clientele was affluent.

 

[alormaria]

I never had any problem filling the short and complete boating courses but the piloting course was always a challenge. And the guy teaching it literally wrote the book.

 

[Seevee]

Be careful about stories and things heard not in print.

Good luck with the instruction, hope it helps.

I am not familiar with power squadron instruction personally, but have heard less horror stories than from USCGAUX instruction.

While both organizations do an unbelievable amount of good.....

Look at the actual qualifications of the instructor. Boating for 50 years or so doesn't make you an expert instructor or subject matter expert...

While you may learn quite a bit, verify what isn't written into the course as I have seen way too much bad info passed along through these courses....even private ones for that matter.

While not the same, a huge amount can be learned from even the free on line courses and then asking around with other boaters or on line for specific questions. The pay courses on line probably allow back and forth contact.

Again, good luck.

psneeled,

And be careful what you read IN PRINT, especially if from a news source or periodical unless the author can be proven to be reliable. A good book by a know author is probably best, as are courses taught by good instructors the follow the syllabus and know how to teach.

Who do you work for or are you and independent? Do you run a lot of classes?

I often shop for a class or seminar around here but looking at USPS and CGA most are at awkward times in the evening when I can't make it, or just a long distance. So I look more for on line stuff. There's a ton of beginner stuff on line, as well as a ton of Captian licensing courses, but not a lot of stuff in-between. Boat US has a few that aren't bad. Others?

And Eddie, Boat US has a good free state course and you get a card upon completion. Worth while: https://www.boatus.org

 

[sbu22]

USPS, in my area (NOLA) has excellent and we'll versed instructors. Your mileage may vary by locale. The basics are the basics - don't think too many courses are going to get them wrong. Study on your own to augment. The USPS Piloting courses are, in my experience, excellent if the syllabus is follows.

 

[psneeld]

I stopped teaching both licensing (5 years for 3 B's school) and NJ boating safety (12 years for Coast Boating School) about 5 years ago.

Believe me I research deeply, often to the source document if I can or need to.... goes along with my background.

Plus, I still think my point is being missed. New boaters are probably going to think the instructor's every word is experienced and correct. While much of the time it is, especially teaching a canned course.....it's when they use their own personal examples to highlight or opinions on off topic questions that it can all go to he**, if they are one of those types that has been boating forever, but really doesn't know crappola, they do a great disservice to the students.

I have had so many people come to me after their courtesy inspections I couldn't even guess. The blurring of the lines between actual law and getting a decal, with completely amateurish explanations keeps me busy for weeks. If they only stuck to what they are supposed to say, the basic courselves or checklist....they would do fine.

 

[Bacchus]

My opinion is biased as I'm a 25+ yr USPS member and certified instructor.
I've instructed our Squadron Wx course for about 15 yrs (6-8 sessions as we only offer it every 2-3 yrs)

USPS courses in general are a good value and I found Piloting & Adv Piloting two of the most interesting & useful courses USPS offers.
The book is an excellent resource and worth the price of admission.
I would bet the local squadron would put you in touch w/ past students if you wanted to get an opinion on the quality of instruction.
Piloting is a popular course and it seems like getting the min # of participants shouldn't be too difficult. Do you have any boating friends you might convince to join you? I'm sure the Squadron would appreciate any help you were willing to provide to help advertise the course.
You could probably get a feel for how many from the Seamanship course were interested in taking the next course.
In cases where there isn't enough participants to hold the course you might consider signing up and ordering the materials and doing some self study as a start - then attending the next scheduled class even if it is at some point in the future.

 

[dhays]

Plus, I still think my point is being missed. New boaters are probably going to think the instructor's every word is experienced and correct. While much of the time it is, especially teaching a canned course.....it's when they use their own personal examples to highlight or opinions on off topic questions that it can all go to he**, if they are one of those types that has been boating forever, but really doesn't know crappola, they do a great disservice to the students.

I get your point and agree completely. As someone who has "been boating for years" I did mention early in this thread that despite all I have picked up over the years, I would benefit from any course I might take. So, I agree with the point that years of boating don't equate to correct knowledge, let alone the ability to transfer it.

So many things that folks like me have just assumed to be true, or have worked in the past, or are what "I generally do" are likely simply incorrect.

 

[BandB]

Actually the courses seem to be $70 for non members and $50 for members, at least in my area. Which in my opinion is very reasonable for an 8-10 week course and materials.

I imagine if we were closer to the coast there would be less of a problem getting enough students to have the courses.

Here is a link to the electrical course in Greensboro NC - https://www.usps.org/cgi-bin-nat/eddept/800/getregformx.cgi?L-14577

Take the course. If they're a bit short minimum, might be worth each of you pitching in a bit more to get it taught.

Take the course and then next get some "on the boat" training at the coast.

 

[dannc]

...
Here is a link to the electrical course in Greensboro NC - https://www.usps.org/cgi-bin-nat/eddept/800/getregformx.cgi?L-14577

I looked at the USPS websites for more information but I could not find the information for which we were looking.

Do you know how many times the class meets each week, how many hours and how many weeks?

We would be interesting in taking the electrical as well the piloting classes if the schedule works out.

Thanks,
Dan

 

[menzies]

Then again, much of my clientele was affluent.

Really, didn't your course discuss BUI?

 

[psneeld]

Really, didn't your course discuss BUI?

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