AIS Pros & Cons?

[man7sell]

If anyone is still following this, I'd love to see what order you would install the following

VHF
Handheld VHF
Autopilot
Radar
Epirb
Night Vision
Stabilized Binoculars
Dingy w/ Motor
Crash pump
Air Conditioning.

Thanks

Well lets see


VHF - Yes
Handheld VHF - Yes have 2
Autopilot - Yes
Radar - yes
Epirb - No
Night Vision - Coming
Stabilized Binoculars - yes for my birthday (I hope)
Dingy w/ Motor - Yes
Crash pump - No
Air Conditioning. - No not needed here in the PNW


Add


AIS - Yes
MFD - Chart Plotter/Radar - Yes

MFD - Cart plotter/fish finder - Yes

 

[SteveK]

Fletcher. Care to name the components that produced that picture. I can see Furono, but list the models of radar & AIS and any integration, looks like a chartplotter too

 

[Fletcher500]

SteveK,

I have attached the 1 line schematic. I spec'd and ordered the equipment but I did not do the install.

Parts list also attached. Everything is Furuno.

AIS components:
-Transceiver FA50.
-AIS Whip: DIG 598SW, 8 ft, height above water approx 30 ft.
-Radar is DRS4D NXT, Dome not an open array.

 

[Pdxstriper]

Not trying to sound like a smart ass but I use neither radar nor AIS when entering or maneuvering in a harbor or marina. I look out the windows. OK I may use radar to judge distance or identify vessels from land but that’s rare. Of course I rarely pull into dock after dark.

For that second situation, your plotter may have an option to hide targets below a certain speed. So in crowded harbors you could set it to hide anything below 1 - 2 kts to get anchored and docked boats and only show the moving ones.

 

[rslifkin]

Not trying to sound like a smart ass but I use neither radar nor AIS when entering or maneuvering in a harbor or marina. I look out the windows. OK I may use radar to judge distance or identify vessels from land but that’s rare. Of course I rarely pull into dock after dark.

For the most part I agree, but some harbors (like NY Harbor) are so large and with so much moving traffic that the game changes a bit and AIS and radar can be a useful supplement to your eyes for figuring out which of the 80 moving vessels around you are of concern.

 

[Circumnavigator]

Not trying to sound like a smart ass but I use neither radar nor AIS when entering or maneuvering in a harbor or marina. I look out the windows. OK I may use radar to judge distance or identify vessels from land but that’s rare. Of course I rarely pull into dock after dark.

You don't say which Portland you are in, but in Portland Maine (and many other places we cruise) there are times when you need both to make it to the dock in the fog. I started sailing in the fog many years ago without any modern electronics -- only a compass, stopwatch, and paper chart -- and have no interest in doing it again.


Jim

 

[mahal]

There are times when looking out the window isn't good enough.

 

[koliver]

I have AIS receive-only on my phone. I use it to identify interesting boats, but when I transit Georgia Strait, between Vancouver and the Gulf Islands, I use its CPA information as go/no go, for crossing the shipping lanes. For that, it is definitely a Safety item.

 

[rwidman]

I have AIS receive-only on my phone. I use it to identify interesting boats, but when I transit Georgia Strait, between Vancouver and the Gulf Islands, I use its CPA information as go/no go, for crossing the shipping lanes. For that, it is definitely a Safety item.

Your phone is receiving AIS signals that have been picked up by a shore based receiving station and relayed to a website. Coverage is not complete, many areas do not have receiving stations. Also, there is often a significant delay in displaying vessel positions.

AIS on a phone cannot be considered a "safety item".

 

[Northern Spy]

If one can see the station locations, the uptime statistics and the time date stamp on the vessel, wouldn't that mitigate the concern? There's better coverage with the station at the top of the hill above my house than I have with an AIS antennae at sea level. There's another one across from me on Denman Island. Green means online.

Furthermore, Marinetraffic will give you a receiver to put online if you want better coverage in your area.

 

[koliver]

Your phone is receiving AIS signals that have been picked up by a shore based receiving station and relayed to a website. Coverage is not complete, many areas do not have receiving stations. Also, there is often a significant delay in displaying vessel positions.

AIS on a phone cannot be considered a "safety item".

I watch the traffic going past my home, on Houstoun Passage, where that traffic includes many AIS displaying commercial and pleasure craft. I watch their signals at the same time as their actual position, so I can verify that I get those signals in real time.
I also get real time signals when I am crossing Georgia Strait, to and from Vancouver. That CPA data is a valuable Safety item, despite having an inherent delay of a few miliseconds while getting to me via shore stations and relay to a website, and hence eventually to my phone. None of that delay is enough to make the CPA inaccurate, as I have observed first hand on many occasions.
In unfamiliar waters I might not get a signal that I woud be able to rely on, so would pay attention to the quality of the data before relying on it. If it turned out not to be reliable, I would be surprised, having good reliability here.
I have also compared the free website, Marine Traffic, for reliability and I can verify that their position data is not often, though it is sometimes, in real time. They can't give me CPA on the free site. Hence I would agree that their data would not be a "Safety item".

 

[SteveK]

View attachment 142856

There are times when looking out the window isn't good enough.

I went fishing in fog like that, no bites, must need sunshine. Used the depth sounder to follow the know fishing hole contours off a paper chart. Another boat following close, also fishing. Of course there were no other crazies out that day we ever saw.

 

[Pdxstriper]

I stand corrected. I’ve been to NYC many times but never imagined boating in such traffic. We cruise the Pacific Northwest and try to dock in daylight hours.

For the most part I agree, but some harbors (like NY Harbor) are so large and with so much moving traffic that the game changes a bit and AIS and radar can be a useful supplement to your eyes for figuring out which of the 80 moving vessels around you are of concern.

 

[Hippocampus]

Believe this thread shows two main camps.

Been doing this for awhile. Started with using depth contours and radio directional finders prior to loran. Used them to tell me where I am on a paper chart. Used celestial to cross blue water. As each piece of tech became available was an early adapter. The old piloting skills remain valuable and give you a mode of thinking where you realize there’s a circle around your assumed position where you’re likely to be accurate. Same with targets of concern for your eyes. There’s a distance where you’re likely to pick up all you need to see. Same with your hearing. Especially in fog where they’re maybe bounce causing you to be somewhat inaccurate in localizing.
Any input has a level of uncertainty. Have had gps be troublesome from degraded signal. Radar give false targets. Depth be wrong from thermoclines or weed. Misinterpreted my own senses.
However as you add inputs that uncertainty becomes extremely less. If three out of four inputs are congruent you discount the forth. You still seek to explain the outlier. But act on the best consistent information.
AIS is another input. Its technology is sufficiently different than the others as to be extremely valuable in lessening uncertainty.
Anytime another’s brain and assessment is added to your situational awareness it’s a boon. A transceiver allows that to happen. Love when there’s another scanning our 360 and view a transceiver serving the same function from a different vantage point.
For me it breaks down like this.
In blue water I’m not much concerned about collision. Ships are generally lite up like Xmas trees. Hard to miss at night. Especially cruise ships. Usually harder to see in the day. Rather I don’t what to come anywhere near them. Now with ships being so large I want to be several miles away from them. With AIS limited by the earth’s curvature and my antenna height I still have sufficient time to react with a two or three degree course change . That’s something I can do in a second or two with AIS input easily. It takes me longer and with more effort with radar. Also I immediately get feedback I’ve changed sufficiently. Sure I confirm with other inputs including radar. But uncertainty is diminished and course change less.
Near shore there’s more traffic but usually smaller in size. Needed circle of safety is smaller. I dislike going on vhf. Unlike the unlikely occurrence of the other vessel(s) changing course mid ocean that is not unlikely to happen when near shore. Especially for commercial fish boats. I can with good reliability infer their intentions easily and quickly with AIS. When there’s several working the same area it’s more difficult with radar and more time consuming. This again allows less need to change AP settings and to a lesser degree. Extremely little need for vhf. But if that’s necessary when there’s one of that crowd I’m concerned about I can call that single vessel knowing how to do it.
Coastal is where a transceiver shines as another input. Many here have delineated its virtues. Won’t repeat.
All inputs (including your senses) are aids to navigation. All are worthwhile for the active cruiser. All aid you in concert and the ascendency of their input varies with situation.

A receiver only doesn’t allow that second set on eyes and brain to add to situational awareness. At least several times a year have gotten a call from another vessel. Things like “we’re going to turn into that berth on your starboard side. Why don’t you slow up while we maneuver “ from a tug/barge”. Or “why don’t you pass me and follow the guy in front. I’m going to dock a half mile up” while going through NYC. Sure those calls are very infrequent but the transceiver makes those occasions stress free.

If some with limited experience with a receiver see limited benefit so be it. Personally appreciate I’m glad to have any input that makes my life on the water lower stress, easier and costs a modest amount.

 

[Circumnavigator]

Believe this thread shows two main camps.

Been doing this for awhile....
...
If some with limited experience with a receiver see limited benefit so be it. Personally appreciate I’m glad to have any input that makes my life on the water lower stress, easier and costs a modest amount.

Well said. I'd add that when at sea and a wheelhouse top looms up on the horizon, it is difficult to see exactly where it's headed (at night the range lights make it easy). Radar requires plotting, which may be a useful distraction when on a boring passage, but AIS tells you instantly.


Jim

 

[jgtrucking]

My order

Air Conditioning.-yes

VHF - 2 at each helm, one in the dinghy

Autopilot - wouldnt leave home without it

Radar - older unit, but have a new garmin radome ready to install

Add AIS IN HERE

Stabilized Binoculars - yes

Dingy w/ Motor - yes

Crash pump -yes

Handheld VHF - 1

Night Vision - yes, awesome tool. Very rarely used, hard to justify the $, but awesome to have anyway.

Epirb - dont carry

 

[Davil1]

ais

Just finished a ran from New Bedford MA to Portsmouth VA, almost 500 miles,4 nights, across several busy shipping lanes.


Have to call a freight cargo ship to confirm he was seen me and confirm my course.

Also was called on the radio by an angry commercial fishing skipper because I was on his way, resolved amicable.

Of course many targets seen, many alarms went off, but those two instances were important and added to my comfort level.
Vesper Watchmate transponder.

2 of us, constant watch visual and hearing.

Radar on

Level of experience

12000 miles of sailing, mostly single or short-handed

Mostly coastal and offshore.

cheers

 

[stow it]

I was an early adaptor of class A AIS with a Furuno unit. That model has no ability to turn off transmit while keeping receive on, which doesn't bother me even though my boat's primary reason for existing is for fishing, and some guys really hate to show their position with the world. If you are in that camp, be sure to get a unit on which transmit can be separately turned off.

I think AIS is better than radar for finding the fleet. Ha, what a great tool if you know what you're looking for.