Thoughts on my ground tackle?

[firstbase]

My current main anchor setup on my Grand Banks 42', 34,000 lbs / 17 tons displacement is:

275' 3/8" BBB chain
#33 Vulcan anchor, 73 lbs.
Mantus S2 Swivel

Just curious about other's thoughts on this. It seems like everything fits and my chain is in good shape, but I am wondering about the S2 vs. the larger S3 swivel.

Any comments are appreciated.

 

[rslifkin]

I'd say that's generally reasonably sized gear. My boat is 38', 26k lbs. So a little smaller and lower windage than a GB 42, but not a lot. I've got the same 73lb Vulcan, but I'm using 5/16" G43 chain (90 feet) and 5/8" 8 plait line (300 feet). No swivel on mine though.



Personally, I'd try yours without the swivel and determine if your setup needs it or not. If it works well without it, save the extra parts, cost of potentially upsizing, etc. and leave it out. If you have trouble getting the anchor into the roller without a swivel, the consider if you should up-size it.

 

[Xlantic]

Why include a swivel. It is an extra cost and additional point-of-failure.

What's the benefit?

 

[firstbase]

I'd say that's generally reasonably sized gear. My boat is 38', 26k lbs. So a little smaller and lower windage than a GB 42, but not a lot. I've got the same 73lb Vulcan, but I'm using 5/16" G43 chain (90 feet) and 5/8" 8 plait line (300 feet). No swivel on mine though.



Personally, I'd try yours without the swivel and determine if your setup needs it or not. If it works well without it, save the extra parts, cost of potentially upsizing, etc. and leave it out. If you have trouble getting the anchor into the roller without a swivel, the consider if you should up-size it.

Thanks. You describe the one issue I am having and what caused me to review it all. The anchor is hanging up at the roller and sometimes causing so much strain that I blow the windlass fuse. I thought moving to the Mantus swivel might help before I look at extending the roller setup so it eases up a little smoother. Also looked at a new windlass so I can add "down" to it, but that turns into a project really quickly given the line up of the port side gypsy and hawse down to the chain locker. I would have to reinvent the wheel as far as I can tell.

 

[firstbase]

Why include a swivel. It is an extra cost and additional point-of-failure.

What's the benefit?

See my last post for an explanation. We also battle with getting the anchor turned properly to come on deck. Invariably it comes up the wrong way around.
A 73 lb anchor and 100 lb wife isn't a good combination.

 

[Xlantic]

I see your problem. Probably a common one (My windlass sometimes struggles at that point.)

Not sure those swivels will solve either problem although it will help orient the anchor by hand.

There are special swivels that are longer and have a "knee" that I think would work.

To bring the anchor up facing the right way I had a machine shop cut a groove on the forward roller so the chain would not twist between the roller and the windlass. I haven't tried it yet, though.

 

[Xlantic]

These would solve your problems:

 

[firstbase]

The bow roller and bracket in the second picture are pretty much what I have now. I was thinking (always dangerous) that a second roller, lower down at an angle would help ease it up somewhat. I have not seen the item in the first picture.

 

[Xlantic]

So even with the compound bow roller the windlass struggles?

I have no experience with these but I was pretty sure they help "getting over the hump".

No personal experience with the bent swivel but to me it seems it would work. Then again, I thought the compound bow roller would work ...

 

[firstbase]

So even with the compound bow roller the windlass struggles?

I have no experience with these but I was pretty sure they help "getting over the hump".

No personal experience with the bent swivel but to me it seems it would work. Then again, I thought the compound bow roller would work ...

Sorry, I must have explained it poorly. At this point I don't have a compound roller setup. Just the single roller much like the one shown in the pic above.

 

[Xlantic]

I describe the one in the picture as "compound" because the bracket where the forward roller is mounted pivots around the pin near the other end.

The base of the is the small bracket on the right. this is fixed to the anchor pulpit and the longer bracket with the large and small rollers the pivots.

As the anchor comes up it would the at a roughly 45º angle and when the anchor reaches it it would go horizontal, as in the picture.

 

[fgarriso]

See my last post for an explanation. We also battle with getting the anchor turned properly to come on deck. Invariably it comes up the wrong way around.
A 73 lb anchor and 100 lb wife isn't a good combination.

Wife should always be twice the weight of the anchor

Al jokes aside, we had a 125# claw anchor that always came up rotated up. We installed two HD chain swivels, then it always came up and self rotated into the rollers in the proper orientation.

 

[firstbase]

Thanks to all. I have the Mantus swivel and will give it a shot. If no change then I think I will look deeper into the new roller bracket. I have seen the rotating brackets but never paid much attention to them. Until now.

 

[firstbase]

One more question on this regarding the rotating bracket. Are these, or should these, be through-bolted or just screwed in?

 

[FoxtrotCharlie]

I would bolt through - just replaced my bolts and beefed up the glass and backing plates below. We have a 60lb claw. and a swivel, with a single roller (grooved) and it comes up perfectly every time - so far.

 

[Wayfarer]

Oh hey Hal, seems like it's been a while. I MISSED YOU!

I have the same issue with my setup, once the top end of the shank gets to the roller, it just stops coming up. I have to send it back down and try again. Sometimes I have to grab the roll bar with a boat hook to help it make the transition.

I was thinking about adding a larger diameter roller to mine, so it's a more gradual transition, rather than a tight little 90 degree operation. I dunno if it'll work, but I'll try it one of these days.

 

[firstbase]

Oh hey Hal, seems like it's been a while. I MISSED YOU!

I have the same issue with my setup, once the top end of the shank gets to the roller, it just stops coming up. I have to send it back down and try again. Sometimes I have to grab the roll bar with a boat hook to help it make the transition.

I was thinking about adding a larger diameter roller to mine, so it's a more gradual transition, rather than a tight little 90 degree operation. I dunno if it'll work, but I'll try it one of these days.

Hey there my friend! That burgee is getting very dated you know...I think we need a new one! ARGHGH!!!!

I have been missing because we have done ZIP with the boat over the past year. Just finished 35 days of a planned 10-day haul out getting everything back in shape and ready to go. Lots of personal things went on over the past year that prevented us from going anywhere but those are all cleared up and we are back in the trawler game! Just need to be able to pull up my anchor without blowing a fuse.....

 

[rslifkin]

The Vulcan is a real PITA to get into the roller backwards. On my setup, it just won't do it. But if it's at least a little bit sideways, it works fine. So if it comes up backwards, I just poke it with a boat hook right before it hits the roller to start it rotating. Once it's a bit off from backwards, it'll rotate the rest of the way on its own, even with no swivel.

 

[backinblue]

The ultra flip-swivel ALWAYS flips my anchor to the proper orientation when it comes over the roller regardless of how it comes out of the water. No interaction necessary.

 

[firstbase]

The Vulcan is a real PITA to get into the roller backwards. On my setup, it just won't do it. But if it's at least a little bit sideways, it works fine. So if it comes up backwards, I just poke it with a boat hook right before it hits the roller to start it rotating. Once it's a bit off from backwards, it'll rotate the rest of the way on its own, even with no swivel.

Comforting to know it isn't just us. We have a hard time rotating it when it gets to the pulpit. Just doesn't want to turn around without a good deal of effort. This is why I am looking to see if a new swivel would help. Only one way to find out!

 

[firstbase]

The ultra flip-swivel ALWAYS flips my anchor to the proper orientation when it comes over the roller regardless of how it comes out of the water. No interaction necessary.

Thanks for the reply and suggestion. I looked at the ultra but not sure how it works exactly. $600 is quite pricey for a swivel.

 

[backinblue]

Comforting to know it isn't just us. We have a hard time rotating it when it gets to the pulpit. Just doesn't want to turn around without a good deal of effort. This is why I am looking to see if a new swivel would help. Only one way to find out!

Highly recommend you look into the Ultra flip-swivel. Expensive but well-engineered and well made. Do some research. It does more than simply allow your anchor to swivel. It automatically orients it for you.

 

[Shrew]

According to Mantus.........


How come both S2 and S3 swivels fit 3/8 Chain, which one should I get?

by Greg Kutsen

The S2 swivel is ideally used for 5/16″ – 3/8″ for Grade 30 or Grade 40 (G4) chain, the swivel will match or exceed the chains ultimate breaking strength. S3 swivel can also fit 3/8 chain to match the loads required for G70 chain. Since Grade 70 chain is uncommon most of the time S2 swivel is the appropriate choice for 3/8 chain. Oversizing the swivel is not recommended; as a bulky swivel can create fit issues, negatively affect anchor set and adds expense.


https://www.mantusmarine.com/faq/ho...swivels-fit-3-8-chain-which-one-should-i-get/

 

[SteveK]

I watch my anchor come up and can always see it hanging in position ready to go over roller in correct position.
What is causing your anchor to rotate hanging from the chain?
Never thought about it before, will have closer look in a few days.

One thought is without a swivel is your chain attached twisted one rotation and the anchor hanging on chain is turned around. easy to see when anchor on board the chain between windlass and anchor.

 

[firstbase]

I watch my anchor come up and can always see it hanging in position ready to go over roller in correct position.
What is causing your anchor to rotate hanging from the chain?
Never thought about it before, will have closer look in a few days.

One thought is without a swivel is your chain attached twisted one rotation and the anchor hanging on chain is turned around. easy to see when anchor on board the chain between windlass and anchor.

We do have a swivel now. It is a galvanized jaw-to-jaw swivel shackle. I think part of the problem is that it isn't swiveling as well as it should. It's not exactly new and I would feel better off replacing it even if the replacement was the exact same hardware.

 

[rgano]

I have always thought the hinged double sheave arrangement on bow rollers is the cat's meow and would resolve a lot of these last-foot-of-retrieval issues.

 

[firstbase]

I have always thought the hinged double sheave arrangement on bow rollers is the cat's meow and would resolve a lot of these last-foot-of-retrieval issues.

Thanks, Rich. The double sheave bracket was also suggested by a guy in the marina where we hauled. Will look at it as well if needed. It seems to make sense. As I mentioned, I already have the Mantus S2 swivel so will start with that and see.

 

[rgano]

Thanks, Rich. The double sheave bracket was also suggested by a guy in the marina where we hauled. Will look at it as well if needed. It seems to make sense. As I mentioned, I already have the Mantus S2 swivel so will start with that and see.

I have the S1 for my 1/4" G4 chain and am quite happy with it. Still could use the double sheave.

 

[backinblue]

According to Mantus.........


How come both S2 and S3 swivels fit 3/8 Chain, which one should I get?

by Greg Kutsen

The S2 swivel is ideally used for 5/16″ – 3/8″ for Grade 30 or Grade 40 (G4) chain, the swivel will match or exceed the chains ultimate breaking strength. S3 swivel can also fit 3/8 chain to match the loads required for G70 chain. Since Grade 70 chain is uncommon most of the time S2 swivel is the appropriate choice for 3/8 chain. Oversizing the swivel is not recommended; as a bulky swivel can create fit issues, negatively affect anchor set and adds expense.


https://www.mantusmarine.com/faq/ho...swivels-fit-3-8-chain-which-one-should-i-get/

Keep in mind there is possibility of galvanic corrosion between a stainless swivel and galvanized chain and anchor. Keep an eye on the connection points.

 

[angus99]

Keep in mind there is possibility of galvanic corrosion between a stainless swivel and galvanized chain and anchor. Keep an eye on the connection points.

Is galvanic corrosion really a concern if the anchor and swivel are not constantly immersed in the same electrolyte (water)? Could be wrong, but I’d have thought the intermittent dunking of the anchor wouldn’t give galvanic corrosion a chance to form.

To the OP, we have the Mantus S2 and it’s a strong, well-made piece of equipment. People unfamiliar with the design warn about the risks of side-loading but it’s virtually a non-issue withheld Mantus. Easy to spin our 80-lb Manson Supreme with a boat hook when necessary.