Polyurethane paint vs. Enamel

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CharlieO.

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Joined
Sep 21, 2020
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1,809
Location
Lake Champlain Vermont, USA
Vessel Name
Luna C.
Vessel Make
1977 Marine Trader 34DC
Looking at "topside paints". Mostly at the marine stores I see the polyurethane paints and primers, but find other brands such as Rustoleum marine coatings are an enamel.

Anyone have experience with both? I like to save some money when I can but also only want to do the job once or a least not have to redo it right away.

I have a boat not a yacht.

Hoping to not have to 'tip' in the process.

First painting projects will be the wood mast/boom and the flybridge 'brow'.

Thanks
 
Charlie - a cruiser couple on an Amel sailboat painted their entire boat in Brightsides. They were quite meticulous and spent the entire summer part time (they were both teachers). I don't think they tipped. I bumped into them almost 10-years later and their boat still looked good. I would practice with some high quality foam rollers - oil based paints seem to lay-down better, probably because they take a lot longer to dry. Frankly, I've had more success NOT tipping than tipping. Seems the less I futz with things the better. Hoping Comodave will chime-in here - he seems to have great input on topics such as these - I'd be interested in his opinion on tipping.

Also, the flybridge brow is perhaps the most noticeable part of your boat. You may want to perfect your technique before tackling.

Good luck - Peter

EDIT - I think San Francisco may be the optimal climate for outdoor paint like this. Weather is not too hot, and often partly cloudy. Hot, direct sun is difficult to paint in. BTW - SF contrary to popular belief, SF is a fairly dry climate. The fog formation is not indicative of the local weather, it's the interaction of offshore moisture dragged-in by high temps in the interior valleys.
 
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Brightside in particular smooths out pretty nicely compared to some other paints. I've never tried rolling it, only brushing it. Within a couple minutes, the brush marks just disappear, so unless you've got serious bubbles, I'd expect rolling without tipping to work fine.

1 part polyurethane paints won't last as long as 2 part and aren't as durable against scratching, etc. But they're also far cheaper and easier to work with. As far as easy 2 parts, Alexseal does have an additive now that lets you roll on their 2 part topside paint without tipping.
 
I used the Rustoleum Topside paint on the interior of Sun Dog. The interior was covered in old nasty carpet. I removed it all from the ceilings and wall surfaces, primed and then painted. I must say that the salon ceiling came out amazing and I applied it using 3/8" nap roller for two coats, sanding with 600g in between coats. I didn't like that it took days for it to fully cure and the off gassing was a bit worse than the Easypoxy that I used on a previous boat.

For the outside decks and house I paid someone to paint with Awlgrip. They used rollers and brushes but did not tip. I personally wouldn't use the Rustoleum on the exterior as it certainly doesn't take the abuse that Awlgrip does.

Just my two cents, ok...thousands! :lol:
 
Ive used Petit EZpoxy paint on my bridge deck, the deck under my dinghy, and even my engine room floor. I'm impressed with how easy it was (one-part, pour-and-paint), how tolerant of prep imperfections it is, how nice it looks, and how durable it is. The engine room floor was the first yest project 3 yrs ago. Except for where I've dropped tools on it there's no sign on wear. It's held up great. The decks still look freshly painted after 2 years. FWIW.
 
The paint industry is rather vague on many things including what their paints really are. Enamels can be Alkyd or Alkyd Urethane and Urethane can be Alkyd Urethane. They can be different or one in the same.
You can improve either one by adding a catalyst. I use the Catalyst Hardener from Tractor Supply. The catalyst improves flow, drying time and hardness.
The resulting coating is able to take things like lacquer after its completely cured. I have used a clear coat over the Rustoleum and improved the life close to that of Awgrip. I was not expecting that and do not remember what clear coat I put over it. I would love to duplicate it myself. 10 years on a truck cap and it still looks beautiful.
 
I use the R enamel on flybridge interior surfaces and some external areas. Most of exterior is EZpoxy one part.

The enamel is much easier to work with in my experience.
The EZ has to go on in thin coats vs the enamel. Don't be afraid of tipping. I use a paint pad or custom trimmed foam brush.

Prep and weather. temperature/sun are important factors, can't be too warm or cold.

I put two coats of enamel on my mast, looks great! It was easy because I had it on saw horses, so all down hand work.

I'm torn on repainting the brow with EZpoxy, was hard to keep a large wet edge under control.

Try both, they're both good products, more care needed with the EZpoxy.
 
I have used Brightside all over my boat. Hull, woodwork, inside nd out.

I love it.

pete
 
Are they though? They all publish data sheets, you just have to look them up.

Example:

https://www.pettitpaint.com/media/4...thane-topside-paint-3106-semi-gloss-white.pdf

Here are all the data sheets published by Petit (for example):

https://www.pettitpaint.com/how-to-advice/safety-data-sheets/
Let me clarify that a bit. When I say same, I mean they can be the same basic molecular structure. As such, they will weather vary similarly over time. Characteristic of flow and application may be quite different.
 
When you look at the amount of work it takes to paint a boat, I want to use a really good paint that will hold up over time. 1 part polyurethane paint is pretty good and easy to apply, think Brightside paint. I painted a lot of the teak on our last boat with it. After 4 years it still looked brand new but the boat was in Michigan so stored inside for 6 months a year and out of the sun.

Then there are the 2 part paints, think Alexseal. They are a bit more difficult to apply but they last way longer. Alexseal has a rolling additive so you only have to roll it on and no tipping required. And the finish is incredible. And it will last and last. For some excellent videos check out Boatworks Today.

But remember that 80%+ of the work is in the prep. If you don’t spend the time getting the surface ready and virtually perfect the finish will show all the defects.

When you look at the overall cost to paint a boat the paint costs for crappypaint compaired to a good quality marine paint won’t be that significant.
 
We have a father and son team in our yard that does some beautiful restorations on classic yachts. Paint work is near perfection. They use Rustoleum. Looks every bit as good as any other paint. Will it last as long as 2 part? Probably not.
 
We have a father and son team in our yard that does some beautiful restorations on classic yachts. Paint work is near perfection. They use Rustoleum. Looks every bit as good as any other paint. Will it last as long as 2 part? Probably not.

And the differential cost wouldn’t be that much to use a good 2 part paint.
 
For me the issue was appearance v the amount of work to paint. I eventually decided that if I could get a paint job looking good from 10 ft away, I was happy with that, as I could do it for far less $ than one that would look fantastic up close. I had the typica yellow stain on the bow, that would come off easily with toilet cleaner, but would come back whenever I went through sewage (Fraser River flows, so hard to avoid). My hull got painted with 2 litres of EZP, and passed the test at 6 ft, so I did the house with another 2 l of EZ. I get compliments, though at less than 6 ft I can see lots of room for improvement.
It is all about your requirement for perfection.
 
The 1 part polyurethane paint is about twice the cost of the rustoleum and the two part is about another 50 percent more.

I realize for my boat it would maybe save me only a couple hundred bucks, but bucks is bucks.

Is one easier to touch up or do spot repairs too?

I am happy with a 10 footer, we use the boat, kids, dogs, kayaks, dingy and bikes.

I think I will start with the Rustoleum and primer on my mast. I have a couple fiberglass things in the garage and could try on that. I'm a few months away from any outdoor painting. If I'm not happy with the Rustoleum on my test pieces, I can use it in my heads or engine room or lazarette and try the polyurethane.

Thanks for all the replies and still look forward to others.
 
My concern with the less expensive paint would be how long it will last. The last thing I would want to have happen with a paint job is for it to peel or otherwise fail in a few years. A test painting of a couple of small areas won’t tell you how long it will last. And if it fails prematurely then you have the joy of sanding it all off and repainting with a more expensive paint. What is the cost of that scenario?
 
It’s always amazed me that as important as painting and varnishing is to boats it’s one of the biggest sources of confusion and frustration. If a owner will invest the time to learn the basics there aren’t too many jobs more gratifying than looking at your work afterwards. Few things bring more admiration from other owners and at the same time add more value to your vessel. So as a former yacht painter and a guy who ran two yard paint shops I think it’s sad to hear people painting teak and nice wood trim just because it’s too much trouble. You know right up the sixties the USN trained deck crews in how to brush paint but these days they usually hire contractors to do what was once a crews job. I can’t tell you how many good looking owner painted boats Ive seen that were owned by ex navy.

Anyway got that off my chest now what about ‘ polyurethane vs Enamel ‘. The answer is none as polyurethanes are enamels. Enamel really only means a high or semi-gloss top coat. Straight up long oil based Alkyd paints are generally old school these days but the paint chemists now combine alkyd resins with polyurethanes to provide a more wear resistant coating. These are one part and unlike coatings such as Awlgrip, Interthane or Imron which are not technically paints ( pigment solids, resins, driers & volatiles that cure by drying ). Two part catalytic coatings such as this use an activator to initiate polymerization and are a true plastic not a paint. They are heavy in isocyanates which are neuro toxins and very harmful to living things.

Enamels like Brightsides are really about the same as the old Inter-Poly, Monopoxy etc.. When I worked as a field Tech Rep for Sherwin Williams I got my fill of marketing schemes, a good grasp of paint chemistry and as a painter ran around putting out fires until I got burned out ( no pun ).From what I can tell Brightsides is a pretty good product but not revolutionary. They’ve tweaked the formula with some leveling agents and volatiles to make it easier to handle, and colors of course, but it handles about the same. They recommend thinner coats roughly 1.5 mils but I’m sure it’s because the special leveling agents that promote flow can also encourage curtains or runs if heavily applied. Pros can handle thicker coats but DIY users will have problems with a brush. However a good brush job by a good painter will get you anywhere from 4-8 mils depending on ambient conditions. This generally equates to longer life, less fade, better abrasion and UV resistance. Trying to compare a paint job life in Seattle or Maine to Florida or the tropics is apples and oranges. The hot high sun is the real standard for longevity. If it holds up down South you’ll be tickled to death up North

Good paint jobs are 80% labor 20% Material
One man’s Good Paint Job can be another Man’s Nightmare
Paint Jobs and Color Schemes are all Subjective
You Can’t See a Good Paint Job In a Photo
A Small Curtain or Run Will Shrink But a Holiday is Forever
A Thin Paint Job is Next Years Paint Job
A Touch of Blue Makes Whites Whiter, Yellows and Reds Fade Faster
Whites Make Vertical Surfaces Taller, Blues Makes Wood Richer
Grays and Gray Blends Go on Lighter Then Darken During Cure
Yellows Don’t Cover as Chromium Pigments are Costly
Slower The Cure The Better The Bond
Condition The Paint For Conditions Viscosity Is Key
Using Paint Straight From The Can Is a Fools Errand
Sanding Finer Than 120-150 Will Not Assure a Smoother Finish
It’s Generally Not Heat That Kicks Paint Off But Wind With Both Go Home
Bit of Spit On a Finger Tip Can Rub Out a Small Run 1/2 Hr Before Tack Off
Rollers Are For Walls Brushes Are For Boats

Rick
 
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Well Dave, that sure would bum me out man. :)
I'll be meticulous as I can be on the preparation and follow the recommendations.
 
We have a father and son team in our yard that does some beautiful restorations on classic yachts. Paint work is near perfection. They use Rustoleum. Looks every bit as good as any other paint. Will it last as long as 2 part? Probably not.

Rustoleum doesn’t make paint they contract and rebadge paint. You buy their product in 2018 and good chance in 2022 it’s a different mix and supplier.. Their are only a few real formulators and they rarely sell under their name. International Paint Company, Koppers, Sherwin Williams, PPG are domestic and quite a few others in Europe like Nobel, Axalta, Akso etc etc

Rick
 
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Hello Rick. Thanks for the info. Much appreciated.

I have several gallons of Jet Glo in Matterhorn white Obviously this is aircraft paint. But would it be a good choice for a boat?
 
Well Jet Glo is a top of line SW aircraft paint. Very expensive in dollars, costly respiratory positive air masks and suits and most of all your health. Very nasty stuff my friend and honestly no place on a boat unless applied in a climate controlled properly air mix booth with full suit and equipment. Aliphatic cross linked coatings involve liberal amounts of isocyanates. Many of my old paint crew are still working with this stuff. They look grey, have facial twitches, no sense of taste or smell and I have no idea about their internals.

Rick
 
Well Jet Glo is a top of line SW aircraft paint. Very expensive in dollars, costly respiratory positive air masks and suits and most of all your health. Very nasty stuff my friend and honestly no place on a boat unless applied in a climate controlled properly air mix booth with full suit and equipment. Aliphatic cross linked coatings involve liberal amounts of isocyanates. Many of my old paint crew are still working with this stuff. They look grey, have facial twitches, no sense of taste or smell and I have no idea about their internals.

Rick

LOL...you should tell that to the paint crews. They paint all day every day in an open hanger. And prime with chromate with a sanding in between. The paint holds up well and looks great though. Very little warranty rework. I am going to experiment a bit more with rolling or roll and tip and see how that works so i dont have to spray.

23047-albums1084-picture7875.jpg
 
JetGlo is similar to Awlgrip, Interlux Perfection and the others.
The problem you'll likely have trying to roll and tip it is that the catalyst (converter) and thinner is made for spraying. They'll cure too fast for roll/tipping.
Same health concerns apply to it as any of the other LP's
 
JetGlo is similar to Awlgrip, Interlux Perfection and the others.
The problem you'll likely have trying to roll and tip it is that the catalyst (converter) and thinner is made for spraying. They'll cure too fast for roll/tipping.
Same health concerns apply to it as any of the other LP's

That is why you Alexseal, just roll and no tipping required if you use the correct additive.
 
I've used the Rustoleum products on my fishing boat and repainting the engine. It was fine and looked great, but was not the hardest (scratch resistant) finish.

On my steel boat I used to roll enamel. Nice and simple. It did not have the gloss of polyurethane but it was simple to apply and inexpensive. Like what someone said earlier however, I consider my boats to be "boats" not yachts.
 
I enjoy spending a lot of time engineering projects and I don't mind spending the time it takes to get installations right, but dedication fades when it comes to the 90-95% of the project time it takes to get paint right.

My gelcoat is as nice as any in our marina and I hope to keep it that way. That said, I have a number of filled holes in our transom and bridge helm that would look better matching the surrounding surface than the off white they have currently. How does the appearance of paint compare to gelcoat in the first few years?
 
I enjoy spending a lot of time engineering projects and I don't mind spending the time it takes to get installations right, but dedication fades when it comes to the 90-95% of the project time it takes to get paint right.

My gelcoat is as nice as any in our marina and I hope to keep it that way. That said, I have a number of filled holes in our transom and bridge helm that would look better matching the surrounding surface than the off white they have currently. How does the appearance of paint compare to gelcoat in the first few years?


In your case, I'd see if you can find a good gelcoat guy to match those spots up (although there's a chance they'll fade differently over time and re-appear). I've seen one of the yard guys at our marina do some serious fiberglass repairs, spray gelcoat to match the surrounding area, and when it was done, you couldn't tell the boat had ever been touched.
 

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