Old boat insurance

[TonyBedortha]

Hello everyone, I'm new to Trawler Forum and I'm looking forward to everything that's available here. My wife and I are looking at a 1979 37' C&L trawler, and I'm hearing that's its hard to impossible to find insurance on older boats. Does anyone have any help on this issue?

 

[psneeld]

Hello everyone, I'm new to Trawler Forum and I'm looking forward to everything that's available here. My wife and I are looking at a 1979 37' C&L trawler, and I'm hearing that's its hard to impossible to find insurance on older boats. Does anyone have any help on this issue?

From what I can tell, experience and previous claims as well as location have a lot to do with it.... member Peter, Pau Hana username is an expert and hopefully will chime in or search the forum and send him a PM.

 

[RT Firefly]

Greetings,
Welcome aboard.

 

[Alaskan Sea-Duction]

Welcome. I agree, send Peter PM.

 

[BandB]

Hello everyone, I'm new to Trawler Forum and I'm looking forward to everything that's available here. My wife and I are looking at a 1979 37' C&L trawler, and I'm hearing that's its hard to impossible to find insurance on older boats. Does anyone have any help on this issue?

Find a marine insurance broker you trust and have them check in advance. They can do so having all the facts from you. They're not just dealing with the boat, but with the new owner and both are factors.

 

[Comodave]

I agree about Pau Hana. Absolutely make sure you can get insurance BEFORE you buy the boat. If you make an offer make it contingent on insurance, survey and loan, if applicable. As said before it isn’t just the boat but they look at your experience in a similar size boat. Good luck.

 

[Pau Hana]

Hello everyone, I'm new to Trawler Forum and I'm looking forward to everything that's available here. My wife and I are looking at a 1979 37' C&L trawler, and I'm hearing that's its hard to impossible to find insurance on older boats. Does anyone have any help on this issue?

Not impossible- older boats just need a bit more massaging so underwriting sees the complete story.

If you're a first time vessel owner, a newer vessel is oftentimes a better risk from the underwriting standpoint. Also, a first time owner will almost certainly require a number of hours of training onboard the vessel purchased prior to any solo operations.

The following all come into play regarding obtaining coverage:

• Vessel age, hull material, drive type, and fuel type
• navigation area
• ownership and operational experience
• marine loss history
• and more.

Let me know if I can be of assistance.

 

[Jeff F]

If you're a first time vessel owner, a newer vessel is oftentimes a better risk from the underwriting standpoint.

That's really interesting.

It's great to get insider views like this. Thanks!

 

[Lepke]

Try:

https://www.hagerty.com/insurance/boat-insurance/
Most insurance brokers can use them or you can go direct.

They do old boats and wood boats, too. And you can get insurance on boats undergoing a rebuild, in some cases.

Last time I used them their usual plan included US and Canadian waters to 25 miles out.

 

[Pau Hana]

Try:

https://www.hagerty.com/insurance/boat-insurance/
Most insurance brokers can use them or you can go direct.

They do old boats and wood boats, too. And you can get insurance on boats undergoing a rebuild, in some cases.

Last time I used them their usual plan included US and Canadian waters to 25 miles out.

Hagerty is essentially Markel these days- much of the underwriting criteria is shared between the 2z

 

[TonyBedortha]

Thanks for the info, I appreciate it.

 

[TonyBedortha]

Thank you Pau, these are all good points. Fortunately I personally should be in pretty good shape regarding these issues. I'm a previous boat owner of a 40' express. I'm a senior first officer for a yacht charter company, and I'm about to go for my 100 ton captains license. I'll contact the company you suggested. Thank you for your help.

 

[BandB]

Thank you Pau, these are all good points. Fortunately I personally should be in pretty good shape regarding these issues. I'm a previous boat owner of a 40' express. I'm a senior first officer for a yacht charter company, and I'm about to go for my 100 ton captains license. I'll contact the company you suggested. Thank you for your help.

Note: Pau was not the one who suggested Hagerty. Just responded to it and it and Merkel are respected, but Pau's suggestion would likely be Pau. lol

 

[SteveK]

Note: Pau was not the one who suggested Hagerty. Just responded to it and it and Merkel are respected, but Pau's suggestion would likely be Pau. lol

Brett, I sense there is an underlying dislike for Hagerty. Care to share?
I noticed Pau Hana does not come out and say try them. Why not?

In reviews I have found they are averaging 4 out 5 stars for both cars and boats.

 

[markpj23]

FWIW.... not quite as old a boat, but 1989 MT trawler in Florida. Checked USAA / Markel got quoted $9200 plus they require haul-out for any named storms or coverage will be suspended!

Found a broker who got a quote from American Modern for $6200 with no haul-out requirement.


Really, really have to shop it around....

 

[Pau Hana]

Thank you Pau, these are all good points. Fortunately I personally should be in pretty good shape regarding these issues. I'm a previous boat owner of a 40' express. I'm a senior first officer for a yacht charter company, and I'm about to go for my 100 ton captains license. I'll contact the company you suggested. Thank you for your help.

Depending on where you are, there are better choices than Hagerty (who, in my opinion, rocks for classic cars and should stay in that arena). Also, Hagerty underwriters are decently versed in marine speak- but not in the same vein a specialty marine insurers.

Note: Pau was not the one who suggested Hagerty. Just responded to it and it and Merkel are respected, but Pau's suggestion would likely be Pau. lol

You know me too well.

Brett, I sense there is an underlying dislike for Hagerty. Care to share?
I noticed Pau Hana does not come out and say try them. Why not?

In reviews I have found they are averaging 4 out 5 stars for both cars and boats.

Hagerty is excellent for classic cars, but (IMO) only so-so for the vessel segment.

 

[SteveK]

D............

Hagerty is excellent for classic cars, but (IMO) only so-so for the vessel segment.

OK, you repeat yourself. However to be able to insure a 51 year old wood boat Hagerty fits the bill well for me. I have no claims, but must have insurance to satisfy marina moorage. The boat is paid for so that money is already lost.

Peter, you have the floor, what doesn't Hagerty offer that should concern me?

 

[BandB]

Brett, I sense there is an underlying dislike for Hagerty. Care to share?
I noticed Pau Hana does not come out and say try them. Why not?

In reviews I have found they are averaging 4 out 5 stars for both cars and boats.

No, no dislike for Hagerty.

Hagerty has an interesting history. They built a great specialty with auto collectors. Then, Markel bought 25% and Alden Financial merged as a SPAC and they went public with more investment from Markel and State Farm.

Pau's comment is that boat insurance through Hagerty will be Markel and nothing wrong with that. Of course, Pau isn't going to say to try a competitor, but he didn't say to run away as he would with Progressive.

 

[SteveK]

Maybe Canada is different, Aviva is the Hagerty partner here. Unless Markel owns Aviva.

 

[BandB]

OK, you repeat yourself. However to be able to insure a 51 year old wood boat Hagerty fits the bill well for me. I have no claims, but must have insurance to satisfy marina moorage. The boat is paid for so that money is already lost.

Peter, you have the floor, what doesn't Hagerty offer that should concern me?

I think he said it, just read between the lines. Hagerty's agents are limited in their marine experience and also will be limited to one line, Markel, vs. a full service marine broker.

If Hagerty can insure you through Markel, then likely ok, but if they can't for some reason, then they lack the knowledge and options others may have.

 

[BandB]

Maybe Canada is different, Aviva is the Hagerty partner here. Unless Markel owns Aviva.

And does Aviva write marine insurance?

 

[SteveK]

And does Aviva write marine insurance?

well I guess they do since they did. Are you in insurance, let Peter explain it if he wants.
There are many here that are worried about getting insurance and Hagerty is offering. There has yet to be a reason not to insure your older boat with a comany that welcomes you. It must be hard to understand for those that run 1/2 million dollar boats.

 

[BandB]

well I guess they do since they did. Are you in insurance, let Peter explain it if he wants.
There are many here that are worried about getting insurance and Hagerty is offering. There has yet to be a reason not to insure your older boat with a comany that welcomes you. It must be hard to understand for those that run 1/2 million dollar boats.

No one has said not to insure through Hagerty. You're interpreting something that just hasn't been said. The OP is not in Canada so Aviva is not relevant to them. I asked the question of whether they provided marine or now as I didn't know and didn't see on their site. In the US, Hagerty will use Markel.

Pau isn't going to recommend Hagerty, and that's not the same as saying not to use them. He's with a competitor. I'm not going to recommend them, because I recommend marine brokers who only deal with marine and they can also sell Markel, if they choose, as well as other lines. As to a recommendation of a Canadian broker, I'm not in position to make one.

 

[SteveK]

Markel is a minority shareholder of Hagerty which continues to be run by the Hagerty family. The way it is being put here is that Markel owns Hagerty.
Yes Hagerty Classic Marine Insurance Agency exists.
https://www.reinsurancene.ws/markel-acquires-stake-in-mga-the-hagerty-group/

 

[Pau Hana]

well I guess they do since they did. Are you in insurance, let Peter explain it if he wants.
There are many here that are worried about getting insurance and Hagerty is offering. There has yet to be a reason not to insure your older boat with a comany that welcomes you. It must be hard to understand for those that run 1/2 million dollar boats.

I can't speak for the BC/Canadian market, as I'm not licensed there (and don't keep up with those markets). A bit of Google-fu shows that Aviva partnered up with Hagerty for the Canadian market. Hagerty remains a primarily classic/collector insurance market. It's been a couple of years since I tore apart a Hagerty policy- but I remember it being pretty decent.

There are markets in the US that will insure older boats- boats that have a good survey, good owner experience, and good storm plans (if applicable).

The reality is that older boats (as a general pool) will continue to have challenges in underwriting. We as owners of older boats (ours is a 1989) can better the odds of obtaining coverage by diligent maintenance, regular surveys, and remaining loss free.

 

[Cleanslate]

StateFarm.
No survey , no matter year of boat. If insured for $50k or less.
Check them out .

 

[boomerang]

StateFarm.
No survey , no matter year of boat. If insured for $50k or less.
Check them out .

Sometimes ,Cleanslate, I like to hold my winning hand close to my chest...Like a undiscovered anchorage or fishing spot, I'm selfish and don't want it ruined by everyone knowing about it.

That said,I think it's up to the agent if they want to write a policy on an old boat or not. State farm has been my insurer for home, autos and boats for many, many years and I've never had an issue insuring an older boat , even a Chesapeake Deadrise that was built in 1948. The new owner of the deadrise had a hard time getting insurance through his State Farm agent ,even after an acceptable survey. I'm not sure where he ended up getting it.

 

[Cleanslate]

Boomerang , coming back at Ya . As a good boomerang toss should . Lol.

Well, that stinks for your friend . I wouldn't think the agent has the much pull in decision making .

 

[Bryant]

Insurance

Hello everyone, I'm new to Trawler Forum and I'm looking forward to everything that's available here. My wife and I are looking at a 1979 37' C&L trawler, and I'm hearing that's its hard to impossible to find insurance on older boats. Does anyone have any help on this issue?

Many companies (Geico included) will not issue a policy on a 40 year old boat. If you buy a 39 year old boat, they will and will grandfather it after 40 as long as the policy never lapses. Your experience and the size of previous boats you’ve owned will be factored in as well. Contact Pau Hana or GEICO directly.

 

[Alaskan Sea-Duction]

Many companies (Geico included) will not issue a policy on a 40 year old boat. If you buy a 39 year old boat, they will and will grandfather it after 40 as long as the policy never lapses. Your experience and the size of previous boats you’ve owned will be factored in as well. Contact Pau Hana or GEICO directly.

Length has alot to do with it too. GEICO sent me a letter of non-renewal as I was too big. 48ft, 1988